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Belly  #362773  Thu, 10 May 07 07:25 AM

1)According to Mr Micheal Swan (pratical English usage, page 486), the first line said:

"note that the conjunction (the second that) is usually dropped in this tructure, it must be dropped if the relative pronoun is a subject

This is the woman (who/that) Ann said could show us the church

I think he implied '(who/that" formed as a subject but I think the subject is only "This is the woman " (who/that) is just a conjunction..... Am I right? Could you please make it clearer?

2) This question has nothing to do with the previous one,I've seen on the 4th page of Oxford dictionary Advanced learner's dictionary, and I found out these line:

First published I948 (12 impressions)

... Seventh edition (4th impression)

I really don't understand "impression" there and the 4th,

3)

Direct: Shall we be there tomorrow?

Indirect: They want to know if they will be there tommorrow

Is the sentence above correct?

Do we step backward from "future simple" to "present simple" tense? And what if the direct sentence in "future continous/ be going to"?

And there from direct will stay in the indirect one?

Please help ASAP
  
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Mister Micawber  #363299  Fri, 11 May 07 08:07 AM

1)  This is the woman (who/that) Ann said [who/that] could show us the church. Swan is speaking of the already dropped second who/that, which I have just reinserted in your sentence-- they are the subject of the dependent clause, 'who/that could show us the church', and must be dropped here.

2) Seventh edition (4th impression) -- it is the fourth printing of the 7th edition.  It has presumably sold out 3 times previously, and more copies were needed; the text, however, was not changed, so it remains the 7th edition.

3)  Direct: Shall we be there tomorrow?  Indirect: They asked if they would be there the next day.

Direct:  Are we going to be there tomorrow?  Indirect:  They asked if they were going to be there the next day.



  
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Belly  #363308  Fri, 11 May 07 08:52 AM
 Mister Micawber wrote:

1)  This is the woman (who/that) Ann said [who/that] could show us the church. Swan is speaking of the already dropped second who/that, which I have just reinserted in your sentence-- they are the subject of the dependent clause, 'who/that could show us the church', and must be dropped here.

2) Seventh edition (4th impression) -- it is the fourth printing of the 7th edition.  It has presumably sold out 3 times previously, and more copies were needed; the text, however, was not changed, so it remains the 7th edition.

3)  Direct: Shall we be there tomorrow?  Indirect: They asked if they would be there the next day.

Direct:  Are we going to be there tomorrow?  Indirect:  They asked if they were going to be there the next day.



Much thanks, Mister, but Swan said again, in page 252 of Pratical English Usage, he gave an example:

Direct: Shall I be needed tomorrow?

Indirect: He wants to know if he will be needed tomorrow

I wonder why he wrote the sentence in future tense, could you make it clearer?

  
Marius Hancu  #363339  Fri, 11 May 07 11:38 AM
Belly:

Re your original posting:
Please post on only one subject at at time.

Now, what tense would you expect instead of future there? It's natural to be the future. Aren't you talking about it?

  
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Belly  #363531  Fri, 11 May 07 05:04 PM
I have no idea! Just because Mr Swan said that in his book
  
Grammar Geek  #363542  Fri, 11 May 07 05:34 PM

Mr. Swan's "will" and Mr. M's "would" are essentially the same.

Would is a little less certain.

Also, we tend to shift the tense backwards in reported speech.

You say "I will be there."
 I say "She said that she would be there." But I could also say "She said that she will be there."

  
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Belly  #363732  Sat, 12 May 07 04:40 AM
But Micheal didn't shift the tense backward!
  
CalifJim  #363733  Sat, 12 May 07 04:45 AM
There is no Micheal.  Do you mean Mr. Micawber or Marius?  Or Michael Swan?

CJ

  
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CalifJim  #363737  Sat, 12 May 07 04:57 AM
I would have answered differently, taking shall we as a request about a possible plan of action or obligation rather than as a true future.

Direct:  Shall we be there tomorrow?
Indirect:  We're asking if we should be there tomorrow.
Indirect, reported later by the same people:  We asked if we should be there the next day.
Indirect, reported later by other people:  They asked if they should be there the next day.

There are many sentences that can be considered the "indirect" form of that original question.

CJ



  
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