Bill McCray    901804 Wed, 29 Oct 08 02:52 PM ""You all" has the same semantics as "yous", right?" "I understand that the pronunciation is usually "yall"." It probably depends upon how fast it is said. If I were speaking carefully and slowly, I would say "you all". At normal rate, even though I think "you all", my mouth says "y'all" or something pretty close to it. I also think "probably" and say "probly". I think those living in this area think "you all", too. I conclude that because "your all's" is the possessive I usually hear ("your all's food will be right out"). Bill Central Kentucky Reverse parts of the user name and ISP name for my e-address Bill McCray Pronunciation, Speaking, Chat, Friendships, Countries, Writing, United States, Possessives, Semantics, Numbers

	Chuck Riggs    650630 Wed, 29 Oct 08 04:49 PM "Is the sibilant in "yous" always vocalized? I have no taped "Sopranos" shows to check." "Do you mean "voiced" (pronounced (z))? Yes, I believe it is. The alternate, probably more common, spelling "youse" suggests the pronunciation more clearly." Not to me it doesn't. "Yous", pronounced "youz", is clearly not pronounced "yoice", which is not so clear with "youse". I don't see how anyone familiar with the language could mispronounce "yous", seeing it in print. Regards, Chuck Riggs Near Dublin, Ireland Chuck Riggs Regards, Spelling, Pronunciation, Speaking, Countries, United Kingdom, Great Britain, Writing, Ireland, Languages

	Chuck Riggs    901806 Wed, 29 Oct 08 04:50 PM "I know only two meanings, well covered by "you" and "yous", if you ever need to go that far." ""You all" has the same semantics as "yous", right?" Yes, Regards, Chuck Riggs Near Dublin, Ireland Chuck Riggs Regards, Countries, Great Britain, Writing, Ireland, Semantics, Numbers

	James Silverton    650643 Wed, 29 Oct 08 05:12 PM Chuck wrote on Wed, 29 Oct 2008 16:49:34 +00: "Not to me it doesn't. "Yous", pronounced "youz", is clearly not pronounced "yoice", which is not so clear with "youse". I don't see how anyone familiar with the language could mispronounce "yous", seeing it in print." I thought the 2nd person plural "youse" (not "yous" in my recollection, but pronounced "yooz" or /juz/) was an Irish word or a New York one (probably imported from Ireland). I seem to remember hearing it in Glasgow too but I'm not sure of that. I note that you live near Dublin; do you find the usage common there? James Silverton Potomac, Maryland Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not James Silverton Plurals, Countries, United Kingdom, Great Britain, United States, Usages, Ireland, Languages

	pritsy    901841 Wed, 29 Oct 08 07:12 PM "In some British and Irish dialects, it's definitely voiced. In ... all". The plural "you" is sadly lacking in "standard" English." "In my region, not to vocalize a final "s" (in youse) would indicate you are possibly of Norwegian ... other Scandianvian groups, but my experience has been among second and third generation descendents, especially on or about Syttende Mai.)" Aha! That's where I remember the unvoiced "S": "Fargo" (the movie). Sorry about using "vocalized" instead of "voiced". Slip of the mind. I first typed, "slop of the mind", which was just as accurate. pritsy Dialects, Plurals, Countries, United Kingdom, Great Britain, Writing, Ireland, Languages, Apologies, Numbers

	Peter Groves    650658 Wed, 29 Oct 08 08:53 PM "Chuck wrote on Wed, 29 Oct 2008 16:49:34 +00:" "Not to me it doesn't. "Yous", pronounced "youz", is clearly ... with the language could mispronounce "yous", seeing it in print." "I thought the 2nd person plural "youse" (not "yous" in my recollection, but pronounced "yooz" or /juz/) was an Irish ... live near Dublin; do you find the usage common there? James Silverton Potomac, Maryland Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not" In what's called "Broad Australian" (basically, a rural and working-class variety) 'youse' is the 2nd person plural (with a voiced fricative) and usually assumed to derive from Irish English. What's interesting about these new plural pronouns like Southern "y'all" is that they are sometimes recruited as "polite" or formal singular pronouns, like French "vous" or Middle English "ye/yow". It's almost as though 2nd person formal singular, a form found in all other European languages and in English up to the eighteenth century, represents a sort of gap in Present English which these other varieties are 'trying' to fill. Peter Groves Melbourne Peter Groves Pronouns, Plurals, Countries, United Kingdom, Great Britain, United States, Usages, Ireland, Languages, Fricatives

	Einde O'Callaghan    650661 Wed, 29 Oct 08 09:37 PM "Chuck wrote on Wed, 29 Oct 2008 16:49:34 +00: I ... James Silverton Potomac, Maryland Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not" "In what's called "Broad Australian" (basically, a rural and working-class variety) 'youse' is the 2nd person plural (with a voiced ... to the eighteenth century, represents a sort of gap in Present English which these other varieties are 'trying' to fill." The formal "you" (the second person plural like the the French "vous") replaced the familiar "thou" by the end of the 17th century. I don't think that the second person plural "youse" (Irish, Scottish and Australian) or "y'all" (South-Eastern USA) could be called formal by any stretch of the imagination. Regards, Einde O'Callaghan Einde O'Callaghan Regards, Plurals, Countries, United Kingdom, Great Britain, United States, Ireland, Languages