Conditional past-future

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optilang  #513288  Tue, 13 May 08 10:17 PM
 The absent student was not the last one of the day - and if I had known that he wasn't attending I could have moved a later class to his slot - resulting in me being able to leave earlier. 

This was the whole point of my original sentence

Hope it's a bit clearer now

Thanks for all the help

Opti 

  
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Ant_222  #513291  Tue, 13 May 08 10:21 PM
optilang: «I would go/be going home earlier - I have not yet gone home (I still have some lessons to teach)»

It doesn't matter when you will go home. The only important detail is the time of your hypothetical going home. If it's prior to the moment of speech, your choice is the Type 3 conditional ("would have"), and the mixed conditional (just "would') otherwise.

EDIT: optilang: «The absent student was not the last one of the day - and if I had known that he wasn't attending I could have moved a later class to his slot - resulting in me being able to leave earlier. »

1. (moment of speech — 13:00) If I had known you would not come to the lesson I would have gone home at 12:30
2. (moment of speech — 12:00) If I had known you would not come to the lesson I would (could/be able to) go home at 12:30
  
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optilang  #513294  Tue, 13 May 08 10:28 PM
 Thnks very much - I think that's cleared it up  - so for example:

 If I had known that it wasn't raining earlier I WOULD play golf tomorrow.

NOT

If I had known it wasn't raining earlier I would have played golf tomorrow.

Many thanks

 

 

  
Ant_222  #513296  Tue, 13 May 08 10:29 PM
That's right.
  
Marius Hancu  #513299  Tue, 13 May 08 10:38 PM
Very rarely is

  would have

used for the future, but I can show you such examples by great writers.  Avoid it.  

  
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optilang  #513301  Tue, 13 May 08 10:41 PM
 I would love to see some examples if you have time to share them

Thanks 

  
optilang  #513303  Tue, 13 May 08 10:46 PM
 Sorry guys but I just can't get this one.

To me  to you would have seems better than using would even for the future.

If I had known he was going this morning I would have gone tonight (I didn't know so as a result I am not going tonight)

seems better than

If I had know he was going this morning I would go tonight.

 

  
CalifJim  #513309  Tue, 13 May 08 11:05 PM
 
optilang
To me  to you would have seems better than using would even for the future.
It seems so.  To some ears it is preferable to relax the logic of time rather than change a well established grammatical structure (If ... had ..., ... would have ...).  I think my ear is similar in this respect.  I would recast the sentence as one of these:

If I had known that he was going to cancel, I could have gone home early. 

If I had known that he was going to cancel, I could have arranged to go home early.

If I had known that he was going to cancel, I would have arranged to go home early.

____

I don't think I would use:

If I had known that he was going to cancel, I would have gone home early.

That seems to indicate that the time has already passed to take the opportunity to go home early, which is not the case in your example.  The same sentence with could doesn't have this objection to quite the same extent, so I put it in the first group, even though it may be considered a borderline case.

CJ 

  
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Huevos  #513327  Tue, 13 May 08 11:48 PM
CalifJim

I don't think I would use:

If I had known that he was going to cancel, I would have gone home early.

That seems to indicate that the time has already passed to take the opportunity to go home early, which is not the case in your example.  The same sentence with could doesn't have this objection to quite the same extent, so I put it in the first group, even though it may be considered a borderline case.

I don't see the problem with using "would have". Even though going home early is still in the future the situation that removed the possibility was in the past and set in stone the events that were going to happen in the future. Maybe I would say: If I had known he were going to cancel, I would have been able to go home early.

  

  
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