Didn't come

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Newguest

#576683 Wed, 15 Oct 08 06:37 PM

If Tom didn't come with us to the beach, everyone would be very disappointed.

--- does the first part of the sentence refers to the future and the second one to the present? I'm not sure I understand it.

Newguest

Joined on Sun, Feb 25 2007

Contributing Member (1,225)

Fandorin

#576686 Wed, 15 Oct 08 06:50 PM

It's called the Second Conditional. It refers to the present or to the future and expresses unreal situation.

If Tom didn't come with us to the beach, everyone would be very disappointed. It means that: He doesn't come to the beach.

Fandorin

Joined on Thu, Dec 20 2007

Russia

Full Member (473)

Whatever happens, be yourself.

Conditionals

Newguest

#576709 Wed, 15 Oct 08 07:59 PM

Look at the very last example on this page:

[link]

According to this: If Seb DIDN'T COME with us.. refers to the future and it is a bit strange to me, though maybe it shouldn't.

Newguest

Conditionals

CalifJim

#576742 Wed, 15 Oct 08 09:47 PM

It's just a normal "Second Conditional".

If he came with us (tomorrow), we would be happy.

If he didn't come with us (tomorrow), we would be disappointed.

We would be delighted if you came with us on our trip next month.

The children's hearts would break if the teacher cancelled the outing to the zoo next week.

The children would be very sad if the teacher didn't fulfill her promise of a special treat tomorrow.

CalifJim

Joined on Mon, Aug 2 2004

California

Veteran Member (17,714)

"There are no facts, only interpretations" - Nietzsche

Conditionals

Newguest

#576744 Wed, 15 Oct 08 09:58 PM

CalifJim
It's just a normal "Second Conditional".

If he came with us (tomorrow), we would be happy.

If he didn't come with us (tomorrow), we would be disappointed.

We would be delighted if you came with us on our trip next month.

The children's hearts would break if the teacher cancelled the outing to the zoo next week.

The children would be very sad if the teacher didn't fulfill her promise of a special treat tomorrow.

CJ

Isn't it better to use the first conditional?

We will be happy if he comes with us

We will be disappointed if he doesn't come with us

We will be delighted if you come with us on..

The children's hearts will break if the teacher cancells..

Thanks

Newguest

Conditionals

Planet Hopper

#576748 Wed, 15 Oct 08 10:05 PM

In second conditionals the past simple is hypothetical, not really time-bound...in some usage grammar books it's called 'unreal past'

Hypothesis or conditionality is not considered time-bound, at least regarding this case. Only first conditionals take the if-clause in present and the second clause in future. The rest of conditional sentences and tenses are bound by aspect (perfection) and unreal reference.

So first part refers to hypothesis, no time...the second tense is subordinated to the first one, it entails future only to the first tense.

The whole patttern looks at the future, as a sequence.

Cheers :)

Planet Hopper

Joined on Tue, Oct 14 2008

Junior Member (69)

Grammar, Tenses, Clauses, Past Simple, Conditionals

CalifJim

#576751 Wed, 15 Oct 08 10:11 PM

Newguest
Isn't it better to use the first conditional?

Not necessarily, but the first conditional is also a possibility. The second conditional simply indicates that we're thinking about the situation in a hypothetical way -- musing about a possibility in a sort of theoretical way -- a sort of "What if?" way.

CalifJim

Conditionals

Newguest

#576753 Wed, 15 Oct 08 10:16 PM

CalifJim
Newguest
Isn't it better to use the first conditional?
Not necessarily, but the first conditional is also a possibility. The second conditional simply indicates that we're thinking about the situation in a hypothetical way -- musing about a possibility in a sort of theoretical way -- a sort of "What if?" way.

CJ

I see. So both conditionals would be OK, the only difference is that first conditional indicates that something will most probably happen and the second that it is just a hypothesis, speculation?

Newguest

Conditionals

CalifJim

#576764 Wed, 15 Oct 08 10:39 PM

Newguest
So both conditionals would be OK, the only difference is that first conditional indicates that something will most probably happen and the second that it is just a hypothesis, speculation?

Yes. That's the basic idea. Smile

CalifJim

Conditionals

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