HB    641649 Tue, 28 Jun 05 07:47 PM "The second site makes a serious error. "mannequin" does not ... diminutives ending on 'ken', while Flemish has lots of them." "Dutch and Flemish are the same language." That is not entirely true. The "Nederlandse Taalunie" (Dutch language union) makes a distinction between written and spoken language. It states that the written language is more or less the same in the Netherlands and Flanders (even though there are frequent differences in vocabulary and syntax). However, as for spoken language the Taalunie states there is no single Dutch language. Instead, there are three substandards: * Dutch: standard spoken in the Netherlands * Flemish: standard spoken in Flanders * Surinam Dutch: standard spoken in Suriname I could go on giving you arguments, but I'll stick to this for now. - Herman - HB Vocabulary, Mistakes, Languages

	HB    641657 Tue, 28 Jun 05 07:49 PM "The second site makes a serious error. "mannequin" does not ... diminutives ending on 'ken', while Flemish has lots of them." "When I lived in Dutch Brabant it was quite normal to form dimunitives with -ke rather than -tje." That is true. Some examples (Flemish versus Dutch): meiske vs meisje (girl) vrouwke vs vrouwtje (little woman poeske vs poesje (kitten) and many many more... - Herman - HB Mistakes, Languages

	Arthur    641664 Tue, 28 Jun 05 08:56 PM "The second site makes a serious error. "mannequin" does not ... diminutives ending on 'ken', while Flemish has lots of them." "When I lived in Dutch Brabant it was quite normal to form dimunitives with -ke rather than -tje." That's correct The Brabant and Limburg dialects ( both southern Holland, so close to Flanders) generally use the diminutive -ke: manneke (little man) - meiske (little girl) - stukske (little piece), etc. Arthur Dialects, Mistakes, Countries, Languages

	Nick Wagg    641670 Wed, 29 Jun 05 09:04 AM "Dutch and Flemish are the same language." "That is not entirely true. The "Nederlandse Taalunie" (Dutch language union) makes a distinction between written and spoken language. It ... * Dutch: standard spoken in the Netherlands * Flemish: standard spoken in Flanders * Surinam Dutch: standard spoken in Suriname" What about the flavour(s) spoken in Indonesia, not that they speak much Dutch there these days - too many colonial hang-ups - or in the Antilles? Nick Wagg Asia, Languages

	John Briggs    641681 Wed, 29 Jun 05 11:53 AM "That is not entirely true. The "Nederlandse Taalunie" (Dutch language ... spoken in Flanders * Surinam Dutch: standard spoken in Suriname" "Accepted. Although one could same the same with regard to Cockney and Georgie." It's usually at this point that I remind everyone of the dictum of the linguist Max Weinreich: "A language is a dialect with an army and a navy." And wonder why he didn't mention the air force :-) John Briggs John Briggs Regards, Dialects, Languages

	Anonymous    641689 Wed, 29 Jun 05 12:18 PM "Accepted. Although one could same the same with regard to Cockney and Georgie." "It's usually at this point that I remind everyone of the dictum of the linguist Max Weinreich: "A language is a dialect with an army and a navy." And wonder why he didn't mention the air force :-)" Very true. I did seem to find that my Dutch in Cologne was often more understood than my poor attempts at German since the latter has always been a language I read rather than speak. Axel Anonymous Regards, Dialects, Languages

	Brian {Hamilton Kelly}    641790 Thu, 30 Jun 05 12:17 AM On Wednesday, in article "It's usually at this point that I remind everyone of the dictum of the linguist Max Weinreich: "A language is a dialect with an army and a navy." And wonder why he didn't mention the air force :-)" 1) When he wrote this, Air Forces were only a couple of decades old 2) Many countries did not have a separate Air Force (cf. Royal Air Force)but instead had air corps within their pre-existing armies and navies (eg USAAF). Brian {Hamilton Kelly} (Email Removed) "Je n'ai fait celle-ci plus longue que parce que je n'ai pas eu le loisir de la faire plus courte." Blaise Pascal, /Lettres Provinciales/, 1657 Brian {Hamilton... Articles, Dialects, United States, Countries, New Zealand, Languages

	John Briggs    641804 Fri, 01 Jul 05 12:29 AM "It's usually at this point that I remind everyone of ... And wonder why he didn't mention the air force :-)" "1) When he wrote this, Air Forces were only a couple of decades old 2) Many countries did not have a separate Air Force (cf. Royal Air Force) but instead had air corps within their pre-existing armies and navies (eg USAAF)." The RAF was 27 years old (although it had its origins in the Royal Flying Corps of 1912) in 1945, and the USAF was to have a separate existence two years later. Air Power had been awfully significant during WW2 - you would have thought that he would have noticed. John Briggs John Briggs United States, Countries