evening (without preposition) / to start to doing

1 2 3
   Share on Facebook  
Yankee  #447372  Wed, 28 Nov 07 11:56 AM
I agree with CJ.

Here's another example with the word evening.  I can easily imagine someone saying something like the following (in everyday English!) to refer to the fact that dusk/sunset arrived an hour earlier than usual after the clocks had been set forward an hour (Daylight Saving Time):

Evening arrived an hour earlier yesterday.



EDIT:
By the way, you'll notice I didn't use an article with dusk or sunset either. Wink [;)]


  
Top 25 Contributor
Joined on Sat, Apr 15 2006
Connecticut, USA
Senior Member (4,011)
ModeratorTeachers
Amy "You can't depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus." - Mark Twain
Espeland  #447378  Wed, 28 Nov 07 12:26 PM
Ok, I think I have to just accept that it is how it is...to me, leaving out the article was so astonishing here because in "evening of a hot day", the evening is defined. And obviously this phenomenon occurs more frequently when the abstract noun is subject or at the beginning of the sentence. Personally, I usually make a difference in meaning between the sentences "I feel the sunshine" (I know which kind of sunshine, or where it comes from) and "I feel sunshine" (I cannot say anything about it, I just feel it, but I may not be able to tell more about it).

But thank you all in any case very much for your responses. Smile [:)]
  
Not Ranked
Joined on Fri, Jul 13 2007
Switzerland
New Member (44)
Yankee  #447380  Wed, 28 Nov 07 12:38 PM
Hi Espeland

In my example, the word evening was used much the same way that the name of a day of the week (e.g. Tuesday) or the name of a month (e.g. August) would be used.  Perhaps that will help you reconcile the missing article.
  
Hoa Thai  #447382  Wed, 28 Nov 07 12:44 PM
Hi,

I understand Espeland's question regarding the phrase 'of a hot day' that specifically restricts the meaning of Evening since there is only one evening in a day; thus,  The must be provided such as "The Evening of a Day of Walking" in Les Miserables - by Victor Hugo.

In fact, I have seen quite a few passages using similar pattern (i.e., abstract noun with article a, an, and the starting a sentence). However, some titles of plays or movies and a few novels that I have read do drop the articles. Therefore, as CalifJim stated (if I read him right), to start a sentence, the article for an abstract noun is optional. In that case, what sounds good to readers' ears would count else words will be ignored.

Best Regards,
Hoa Thai
  
Top 75 Contributor
Joined on Mon, Oct 15 2007
Vietnam
Contributing Member (1,092)
Proficient SpeakerTrusted Users
Best Regards - Hoa Thai
Cool Breeze  #447402  Wed, 28 Nov 07 01:50 PM
 CalifJim wrote:
CB,

I hate to disagree, because your comments are always so very helpful and appropriate, and you are such a valuable resource on the forum.

Nevertheless, I don't think any poetic license whatever is involved here.


Thank you for your kind words, Jim. Smile [:)] As English is not my mother tongue, I don't always succeed in choosing the best wordSleep [S] for everything. Poetic licence may not be the right expression. What I meant is this basic grammatical fact: if the of-genitive is used, the usually precedes the noun before the of:

What's the name of this town?
I don't like the color of the floor.
This is the address of the man in question.

The
is used in the above examples because "this town" has only one name, "the floor" has only one color and "the man in question" has only one address. Or that's what the sentences imply, anyway. Because "a hot day" has only one evening, English grammatical rules would require:

The evening of a hot day...

Yet Steinbeck omitted the article. To call that "poetic" may not be a good idea after all. I just couldn't think of a better word when I wrote my previous post. I meant that grammatical rules required an article but Steinbeck preferred not to have one, in other words, he violated a grammatical rule, which is fairly common in poems.

As you and all native speakers of English know, the is not used in similar of-structures when the noun before the of refers to one of many:

He was a representative of Portugal in the Sydney Olympics.

This time there were many other representatives, that's why a is used. But:

She was the representative of Portugal in the beauty contest. (= the only representative)

An evening of a hot day appears inconceivable to me because a day doesn't have many evenings. Therefore, the really should be used, but Steinbeck thought differently for reasons known only to him.

Cheers
CB


  
Top 50 Contributor
Joined on Fri, Apr 7 2006
Helsinki, Finland
Senior Member (2,543)
Proficient SpeakerTrusted Users
The coldest winter I ever spent was a summer in San Francisco.- Mark Twain
CalifJim  #447507  Wed, 28 Nov 07 06:47 PM
OK.  Now I see what you're focusing on -- the prepositional phrase that restricts the meaning of the noun.   You may be right about that.  Yet it seems that we can invent examples that have the same pattern.

Light from several lanterns filled the room with a soft glow.
Laughter of children was heard on the playground.


Hmm.  Do these have to be The light ... and The laughter ...Tongue Tied [:S]

They seem to work better when the preposition is from than when it's of.  It's the 'part of whole' relation that seems to require the article.  So maybe evening of a hot day is just a bit unusual, though I don't really hear it as very odd.

CJ

  
Top 10 Contributor
Joined on Mon, Aug 2 2004
California
Veteran Member (15,994)
ModeratorProficient Speaker
"There are no facts, only interpretations" - Nietzsche
Cool Breeze  #447547  Wed, 28 Nov 07 08:51 PM
 CalifJim wrote:

Light from several lanterns filled the room with a soft glow.
Laughter of children was heard on the playground.


Hmm.  Do these have to be The light ... and The laughter ...Tongue Tied [:S]

I certainly don't want to criticize Steinbeck's English at all. I dealt with the of-genitive in my previous post and there isn't one in your first sentence, so I'll say nothing about it. Laughter of children is also different grammatically since laughter is an uncountable noun, unlike evening. I'm not saying this is always the decisive factor but in this case it seems to make the difference in the use of the article, at least to me. When laughter of children was heard, it means that some laughter was heard, not necessarily all of it, and consequently dropping the article is normal.

This is how I understand the difference and I don't mind at all if some people disagree with me.Smile [:)]

CB
  
CalifJim  #447565  Wed, 28 Nov 07 09:45 PM
since laughter is an uncountable noun, unlike evening.
Unlike eveningWow!  In that sentence I understand evening as uncountable!  (evening-ness?)  Aren't all singular nouns in English uncountable when used without articles?
 
CJ

  
MrPedantic  #447592  Wed, 28 Nov 07 11:27 PM

Out of interest, would anyone object to the articleless "Evening" in the original example if it were a case of personification?

MrP

  
Top 10 Contributor
Joined on Tue, Oct 12 2004
Veteran Member (11,852)
Proficient SpeakerSystemAdministrator
...opella forensis / adducit febris...
1 2 3
AddThis Feed Button RSS Feed: ESL General English Grammar Questions
© 2008 MediaCET Ltd.
Terms and Conditions