d_say  +  662414 Wed, 04 Feb 09 06:22 AM Hi Friends, Please assist me with the following sentences. In first sentence 3rd form of the verb used after 'having' while in second sentece 3rd from of the verb used after 'been'. 1). Having eaten an apple he went away. 2). Having been beaten the servant ran away. The concept of both of these sentences made a bit complication for me to understand the time of the action like if the second sentence belongs to past or present.  Hope to have a reply at ur earliest. Thanks, d_say Joined on Thu, Nov 6 2008 Universe Junior Member 96 Relationships, Sentences, Friendships, Friends

	Avangi  +  662519 Wed, 04 Feb 09 08:53 AM They're both in the same time frame. The difference is that one is passive voice and one is active voice. Having been eaten by a lion, the king missed his appointment with the queen. Having beaten the servant at chess, the king decided to celebrate. The simple verbs in the main clauses are all simple past:  went; ran; missed; decided. In each sentence, the perfect participles describe an action which is completed before the main (past tense) action begins. Avangi Joined on Mon, Nov 19 2007 Veteran Member 8,211 ". . . le plaisir delicieux et toujours nouveau d'une occupation inutile." - Henri de Regnier Tenses, Clauses, Simple Past, Past Tenses, Writing, Sentences, Simple Tenses

	d_say  +  663453 Thu, 05 Feb 09 07:32 AM Thank you Avangi, I am pleased to have your prompt response. Can you put some light on the use of "HAVING" ? I mean could you guide me further if I use of "Having..." and is there any structure that we could use in replacement of " Having.."? and ... "Having been eaten by a lion, the king missed his appointment with the queen."  For instance if I would like to convert it into active voice, how should it be written? Thank you again, d_say

	Avangi  +  663898 Thu, 05 Feb 09 06:08 PM We must take care not to confuse the two issues.  The transitive action verb here is "to eat."  The "have" and the "been" are just helpers, or "auxilliaries." "Have" makes it "perfect," meaning the action has been completed. "Been" makes it "passive voice," meaning the subject receives the action, rather than performing it. Another complication exists because we're using the "-ing" form of the verb (present participle) rather than a simple tense, such as "he eats the food" (active voice); "the food is eaten by him (passive voice). "He, having eaten the food, took a nap." (active voice)  "The food, having been eaten by him, was slowly starting to be digested." (passive voice) Notice that you can remove the "having" phrase from the sentence, and what you have remaining is a complete sentence by itself.  Coming at the begining of the sentence as it does, the "having" phrase gives us additional information describing the main sentence, which follows.  It will most likely describe the subject of the main sentence. The thing about passive voice is that you can't always tell who or what is doing the acting. Having been stabbed, the king was not feeling well. If you wish to convert this to active voice, you need to make something up.  Having stabbed the king, the intruder fled on horseback. Having eaten the king, the lion took a nap. When you perform a passive-to-active transformation, the subject and the object exchange places.  If you wish to keep the original meaning, other things will have to change. Since the lion ate the king, the king missed his appointment with the queen. Avangi Tenses, Simples Tenses, Sentences

	CalifJim  +  663913 Thu, 05 Feb 09 06:38 PM Maybe this little chart will help.  Note the similarity of the participial form to the present perfect main verb shown below.                 Active                                                      Passive Main Verb          Participial Form                Main Verb                Participial Form have/has beaten          having beaten       have/has been beaten    having been beaten have/has eaten            having eaten        have/has been eaten      having been eaten Tom has beaten the servant.   Having beaten the servant, Tom went away. The servant has been beaten by Tom.  Having been beaten by Tom, the servant went away. Tom has eaten the apple.  Having eaten the apple, Tom went away. The apple has been eaten by Tom.   Having been eaten by Tom, the apple was no longer available for Lucy to eat. CJ CalifJim Joined on Mon, Aug 2 2004 California Veteran Member 22,474 "There are no facts, only interpretations" - Nietzsche Present Tenses, Present Perfect

	d_say  +  670484 Thu, 12 Feb 09 08:17 AM Dear Avangi and CJ. Respected friends I am very thankful to you for your superb help. grateful to both of you best regards d_say d_say Relationships, Friendships, Friends

	keepsmiling  +  870918 Fri, 21 Aug 09 06:29 PM just one word to say thanks for such help---AWESOME WORK keepsmiling Joined on Fri, Dec 5 2008 Delhi Junior Member 59