We have partnered with TradePub to bring you free industry magazines and resources - no coupons or credit cards required!
Visit: englishforums.tradepub.com
|
|
|
|
|
|
temico
+
99071
Fri, 13 May 05 11:10 PM
Thanks for the reply Abbie,
Re: I haven't seen him before." (i.e. I've never seen him in my life)
I wonder if you realise that, "I haven't seen him before." means "I haven't seen him before NOW( this very moment)." A person CAN'T say "I haven't seen HIM." if s/he hasn't SEEN him (at least once) or DOESN'T even who this HIM is? Or can he/she??
If "I haven't seen him before now." is correct English, then, "I haven't eaten lunch before now.", is also correct English, but does it mean, "I haven't eaten lunch is my life", may I ask??
Joined on
Thu, Apr 21 2005
Full Member
274
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
MrPedantic
+
99081
Sat, 14 May 05 12:06 AM
For non-UK members, here are a few Prescottisms. Translations are available for those whose first language is English:
"I would like to make some start in my speech."
"It's not the sanity of the picket lines that bothers me, it's the sanity of human life."
"On housing and charities you have difficulties about the financing of long-term finances affecting those housing, very real problems and I'm sure that we agree with them, but it was good for conference but it wasn't much action, it was an awful lot of getting the conference going, yes I will give way."
"For the first time hypothecating any real increase in fuel duty to roads and public transport and I invite them to say if this hypothecation they are compared to adopt it."
"I saw in the paper today how many Transport Ministers, Barbara Castle, they said, was popular, when Barbara Castle brought in seat belts and drunk driving, she was very unpopular."
"The sustainable conference about which we discussed from Doha to Monterrey and on to Johannesburg, and this is a global framework, we need to bring it back together in a complete frame, as indeed it was in Rio."
[On landing at an airport after a bumpy ride.] "It's great to be back on terra cotta."
"Even the prime minister has done a lot more to do."
"I'm asking you, if I give you these facts, you're supposed to give some factual analysis to it. I mean you're not denying that these facts are wrong, are you?"
"So I think the basic point that it is necessary in order to have private capital in our industries to get the extra resources that we do want that you have to be privatised is not borne out by the facts, in other countries and neither we should we have it here also and if he's in any doubts about that go and have a look at the reports that talk it."
MrP
Joined on
Tue, Oct 12 2004
Veteran Member
12,592
...opella forensis / adducit febris...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
MrPedantic
+
99084
Sat, 14 May 05 12:19 AM
JTT:
In the newspaper, just a few weeks ago, Tony Blair, in reference to the WMDs stated,
"I've already discussed that last year."
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I would take the 'last year' here as an afterthought, that clarifies 'already':
1. I've already discussed that (last year).
The CGEL example would be more natural if expanded:
2. He has got up at five o'clock for the last 20 years.
2a. He's been getting up at five o'clock for the last 20 years.
In the 2nd CGEL example, there seems to be a conflict between the adverbs, unless we treat the 2nd as a clarification:
3. We've already discussed this – yesterday.
MrP
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
MrPedantic
+
99085
Sat, 14 May 05 12:22 AM
Prescott even manages to misspell the spoken word.
MrP
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Roro
+
99102
Sat, 14 May 05 01:59 AM
Very perceptive.....
We love you ![Wink [;)]](/emoticons/emotion-5.gif) !
I have two questions to MrPedantic. May I ask you?
1. What does CGEL means?
2. Can I insert the word or into your examples ? That is...
(1) He has usually/sometimes got up at five o'clock for the last 20 years.
(2) He's been getting up usually at five o'clock for the last 20 years.
If it's possible, then it would be .... more natural? or less? Please help me!
Joined on
Mon, Apr 11 2005
Regular Member
581
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
abbie1948
+
99104
Sat, 14 May 05 02:01 AM
| I wonder if you realise that, "I haven't seen him before." means "I haven't seen him before NOW |
|
Obviously it must mean "I haven't seen him before NOW". If I were not looking at him, either in reality or in a photograph, I could not make a claim to never having seen him before Sorry, temico, I just assumed you would understand that, given your study of English to date.
| If "I haven't seen him before now." is correct English, then, "I haven't eaten lunch before now.", is also correct English, but does it mean, "I haven't eaten lunch is my life", may I ask?? |
|
It could equally well mean that temico; why not? One must never assume that one's own habits, whether in dining or in language, are the same for everyone else.
Joined on
Thu, Mar 24 2005
England
Senior Member
2,657
Hope that helps. Abbie
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
MrPedantic
+
99110
Sat, 14 May 05 02:12 AM
Hello Roro
1. CGEL is the 'Cambridge Grammar of the English Language'. One or two members like to quote from it. It's quite expensive, but you can find some sample chapters here:
http://uk.cambridge.org/linguistics/cgel/
2. If you change it slightly, yes:
i) 'During the last 20 years, he has sometimes got up at 5 o'clock.'
ii) 'For the last 20 years, he's usually got up at 5 o'clock.'
The 'progressive' version sounds slightly awkward, though:
iii) ??'He's been getting up usually at five o'clock for the last 20 years.'
I would say that they're not particularly natural sentences; it would be unusual to find an opportunity of using them!
MrP
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Roro
+
99113
Sat, 14 May 05 02:23 AM
I see.. Thank you, MrPedantic. I would not use them in writing. Your information gives me a broad, flexible perspective. Thank you, from the heart. Roro
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
just the trout
+
99130
Sat, 14 May 05 04:30 AM
| Please avoid personal comments/attacks in the forum. If nothing else, this sort of comments seems to indicate that the poster is unable to defeat the other party's line of argument (thus resorting to personal comments). |
|
My comment was simply a repeat of the inane comment from Mr Pedantic which "seems to indicate that the poster is unable to defeat the other party's line of argument (thus resorting to personal comments)".
Tony Blair:
The son of a barrister and lecturer, Tony Blair was born in Edinburgh, but spent most of his childhood in Durham. At the age of 14 he returned to Edinburgh to finish his education at Fettes College. He studied law at Oxford, and went on to become a barrister himself.
Joined on
Mon, May 2 2005
New Member
14
|
|
|
|
|
|