indefinite article with proper name

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Muttley

#447321 Wed, 28 Nov 07 09:24 AM

hi everyone!

ok, here goes, first post...

what's the rule for using the indefinite article with an adjective, before a proper name, as per the following examples?

1. I gave the present to an unsuspecting Helena.

2. Alfie then shut the gate and ambled off to the house, shaking his head in perplexity, to complain to a sympathetic Dora in the kitchen.

thanks!

Muttley

Joined on Tue, Nov 27 2007

prague

New Member (05)

Tidus

#447328 Wed, 28 Nov 07 09:44 AM

If the word begins with a vowel - ie 'unsuspecting' then it is preceded by 'an', if it doesn't ie 'sympathetic', then it is preceded by 'a'.

Tidus

Joined on Mon, Nov 27 2006

England

Full Member (360)

Articles, Indefinite articles, Definite articles, Vowels

Muttley

#447727 Thu, 29 Nov 07 08:40 AM

Thanks tidus, but the question referred to the connection between the indefinite article and the proper name, ie. an ...... Helena and a ........ Dora. An indefinite article is never usually used before a proper name, (and only in some cases can the definite article be used before a proper name) but it seems to be the case in the examples I gave. Anyone can tell me why?

Muttley

Articles, Indefinite articles, Definite articles

Cool Breeze

#447742 Thu, 29 Nov 07 09:41 AM

Hi Muttley

Unfortunately there are a myriad cases involving proper nouns with adjectival attributes and the indefinite article. You'll just have to learn them piecemeal. As you said in your first post, a/an is often used with a person's name:

We met a sad George yesterday.

The indefinite article is usually not used with place names in similar cases:

We arrived in fascinating Amsterdam yesterday.

To my mind, the use of the articles in general is the most difficult single aspect of English grammar because very often there is absolutely no logic to it and there are thousands, if not tens of thousands of idioms with or without an article. Just be patient and don't lose heart when you realise the absence of logic and order. Smile [:)]

Cool Breeze

Joined on Fri, Apr 7 2006

Helsinki, Finland

Senior Member (2,692)

The coldest winter I ever spent was a summer in San Francisco.- Mark Twain

Articles, Grammar, Nouns, Indefinite articles, Definite articles, Idioms, English grammar

Muttley

#447745 Thu, 29 Nov 07 10:09 AM

thanks cb! i try not to lose heart....

could i also ask what the difference would be if i used the definite article or 0 arcticle in my first example.....

I gave the present to an unsuspecting Helena.

I gave the present to the unsuspecting Helena.

I gave the present to unsuspecting Helena.

Are the last two also grammatically correct?

Muttley

Articles, Indefinite articles, Definite articles

Cool Breeze

#447751 Thu, 29 Nov 07 10:26 AM

It seems to me that you are trying to climb a tree from the wrong end, Smile [:)]

as we say in Finnish. To me your most immediate language acquisition activities should entail learning to capitalize I and all sentences rather than the grammatical finesse your mind is set on.

Of your sentences, the first and the third seem OK to me even though I wonder why No. 3 sounds good, without an. I can't think of any reason at the moment, perhaps another member can. The second sentence could perhaps be said if "Helena" had been mentioned before, or in the theoretical event that there were several Helenas present and one of them was unsuspecting or in some similar case.

The is more often used when the person is famous: The great William Shakespeare wrote many immortal plays.

CB

Cool Breeze

Articles, Indefinite articles, Definite articles

Muttley

#447800 Thu, 29 Nov 07 12:26 PM

Thanks again, CB. And I accept your admonition gracefully. It's just that I forget that I'm writing in an English language forum and not in a text or e-mail message to friends. Smile [:)]

Muttley

Articles, Indefinite articles, Definite articles

Yankee

#447809 Thu, 29 Nov 07 12:51 PM

Muttley wrote:
thanks cb! i try not to lose heart....

could i also ask what the difference would be if i used the definite article or 0 arcticle in my first example.....

I gave the present to an unsuspecting Helena. OK. The use of 'an' suggests that it has not been previously mentioned that Helena didn't suspect anything.

I gave the present to the unsuspecting Helena. OK. The use of 'the' suggests that it has already been mentioned or implied in the previous context that Helena didn't suspect anything.

I gave the present to unsuspecting Helena. I would not use this sentence.

Are the last two also grammatically correct?

Yankee

Joined on Sat, Apr 15 2006

Connecticut, USA

Senior Member (4,102)

Amy "You can't depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus." - Mark Twain

Articles, Indefinite articles, Definite articles

Philip

#447846 Thu, 29 Nov 07 02:52 PM

Muttley wrote:

hi everyone!

ok, here goes, first post...

what's the rule for using the indefinite article with an adjective, before a proper name, as per the following examples?

1. I gave the present to an unsuspecting Helena.

2. Alfie then shut the gate and ambled off to the house, shaking his head in perplexity, to complain to a sympathetic Dora in the kitchen.

thanks!