khoff  +  952894 Sun, 25 Oct 09 10:27 PM "Damn you, Oponn!  Your jests never give me a chance!"  is a more understandable way of saying what I think you are trying to say. khoff Joined on Sun, Mar 6 2005 Senior Member 3,264 Native speaker of American English (but not a grammar expert)

	cosmin_parvulescu  +  952950 Sun, 25 Oct 09 11:59 PM Perhaps a little insight will help, " 'Oponn.' The two-faced Jester of Chance " from "The Gardens of the Moon" ( great book by the way ). I understand the difference between a single jest, and the action of 'jest[ing]', but my question was whether I could use 'jest' in a special ( poetic perhaps ) way to account for all the actions ( related to jesting ) a person has. As for GG's question, "It never chances I". It never gives me the oportunity to win, it never gives me the chance to come out victorious from Oponn's pranks, chance is not on my side while he is meddling with *my* destiny for his own amusement. Not sure if I cleared anything with this :P As for " Damn you, Oponn, how your tune never changes! ", it could be considered similar, think of it as this way, Oponn's tune is refered here as his whole repertoir, every single *song* he plays is similar, it never changes. Thus, you may be referring to an unspecified number of tunes. Likewise, I am refering to an unspecified number of acts in his jest, but using the singular for all of those as jest. Tell me if I'm making any sense here Also, sorry for any mistakes that might slip in, english is not my main Thank you cosmin_parvulescu Joined on Sun, Oct 25 2009 Romania New Member 05 "The sting brings death, so my hand defies sorcery's web and trembles the gossamer strand of a spider's deadly threat" Difference Between, Writing, Mistakes, Apologies, Numbers

	cosmin_parvulescu  +  952952 Mon, 26 Oct 09 12:01 AM khoff “"Damn you, Oponn!  Your jests never give me a chance!"  is a more understandable way of saying what I think you are trying to say. ” Of course it is, but I'm trying to make it sound more poetic, older perhaps. Playing with words is fun and I'm really interested if I juggled them right cosmin_parvulescu

	khoff  +  952961 Mon, 26 Oct 09 12:14 AM Well, if your intention  was to be understood, then I would say you did not "juggle them right".  It certainly sounded poetic and old-fashioned, but I had no idea what you meant.  Even now that I know what you are trying to say, in my opinion "Your jest/s never chance/s I"  does not make any sense. khoff

	Avangi  +  953055 Mon, 26 Oct 09 01:52 AM c/p, are you conversant with the concept of countable nouns vs. uncountable nouns?  We have this discussion often on the forums. I tried to suggest in my last post that this might be what you were reaching for in your singular vs. plural question.  I wasn't sure if you followed me. That jest was amusing.  singular, a countable thing. Those jests were amusing.  plural, countable things. Your jest is wearing me down. (always singular) uncountable stuff. Avangi Joined on Mon, Nov 19 2007 Veteran Member 8,172 ". . . le plaisir delicieux et toujours nouveau d'une occupation inutile." - Henri de Regnier Plurals, Nouns, Uncountable Nouns, Countable Nouns

	cosmin_parvulescu  +  953319 Mon, 26 Oct 09 08:23 AM Avangi “I wasn't sure if you followed me. That jest was amusing.  singular, a countable thing. Those jests were amusing.  plural, countable things. Your jest is wearing me down. (always singular) uncountable stuff. ” I understand what you are trying to say by countable/uncountable, my problem lies in the '(always singular)' part, are you saying that 'jest' is singular or that the action is singular ? cosmin_parvulescu Plurals

	Avangi  +  953411 Mon, 26 Oct 09 10:16 AM I'm saying that in this sentence the uncountable noun "jest" is singular, and therefore calls for a singular verb, "is." It's like saying, "Your foolishness is wearing me down." Many nouns have both a countable and an uncountable use.  You wouldn't use a plural verb with the uncountable noun. But with the countable use, of course it's possible to have a count of "one."  In this case, the singular verb is appropriate. Avangi Verbs, Singular Verbs, Plurals, Nouns, Uncountable Nouns, Sentences, Singular

	khoff  +  953627 Mon, 26 Oct 09 02:25 PM In my opinion, the singular/plural choice is of little significance compared to the attempt to make "x never chances I" mean "x never gives me a chance."   khoff

	cosmin_parvulescu  +  953640 Mon, 26 Oct 09 02:35 PM khoff “In my opinion, the singular/plural choice is of little significance compared to the attempt to make "x never chances I" mean "x never gives me a chance."   ” So basically it's a stupid way of saying it :P cosmin_parvulescu