paco2004  +  192997 Mon, 06 Feb 06 12:34 AM Hello We often come across a sentence as below.       (EX) She found a position teaching English at a high school. I understand the meaning of the sentence. But I'm wondering how to parse the sentence. From the meaning, "teaching English" should be a phrase to backwardly modify "a position". But is it grammatical to put a gerundive modifier directly to a noun to be modified? paco paco2004 Joined on Wed, Nov 17 2004 Senior Member 4,095 In Japan today even dogs are learning how to bow-wow in English. Nouns, Teaching English

	Clive  +  193009 Mon, 06 Feb 06 01:32 AM Hi Paco, I'm not good at naming things, but is it not  a participle functioning more as an adjective than as a gerund? Clive Clive Joined on Thu, Oct 28 2004 Canada Veteran Member 29,612 El tango argentino es un pensamiento triste que se puede bailar (The tango argentino is a sad thought which can be danced) Enrique Santos Discépolo Gerunds

	paco2004  +  193012 Mon, 06 Feb 06 01:38 AM  Clive wrote: I'm not good at naming things, but is it not  a participle functioning more as an adjective than as a gerund? Clive, Thank you for the quick reply. I thought that possibility. But can "a position" teach English? paco paco2004 Gerunds

	rvw  +  193015 Mon, 06 Feb 06 02:02 AM I think the phrase teaching English at a high school is in apposition to position.  The sentence could have been written: She found a position -- teaching English at a high school. or      She found a position -- namely, teaching English at a high school. The gerund teaching is not a modifier.  It (with the rest of its phrase) is a substantive that points to the same thing as position.  It is a different construction from They found the student crying, in which crying is a present participle which modifies student.  rvw Joined on Sun, Nov 28 2004 Woodstock, Georgia, USA Full Member 350 Constructions, Gerunds, Teaching English

	paco2004  +  193021 Mon, 06 Feb 06 02:33 AM Hello RVW Thank you for the answer. Your thought sounds someway more reasonable. But still I cannot feel confident. If "teaching English" is appositive to "a position", I think, "She found teaching English at a high school" should be idiomatic, but it is not the case. Furthermore, we cannot use along with "a position" any noun phrase other than --ing. For example, "She found a position instruction of English at a high school" sounds weird. So… paco paco2004 Nouns, Noun Phrases, Teaching English

	rvw  +  193024 Mon, 06 Feb 06 02:44 AM paco2004, I had doubts when I posted.  There seems to be something more to this.  I will think about it some more. rvw rvw

	CalifJim  +  193045 Mon, 06 Feb 06 04:14 AM is it grammatical to put a gerundive modifier directly to a noun to be modified? I would say yes.  You could probably find more examples of the same structure.  You may debate whether the following sentence follows the structure you have in mind (maybe it's not "gerundive" enough), but I think it is generally within the sphere of the sorts of things you are asking about. The book contained only two paragraphs explaining the cause of the Civil War. CJ CalifJim Joined on Mon, Aug 2 2004 California Veteran Member 22,399 "There are no facts, only interpretations" - Nietzsche Nouns, Paragraphs

	Clive  +  193063 Mon, 06 Feb 06 05:36 AM Hi guys, But can "a position" teach English? Well, I have a teaching position. It's pretty adjectival there. Is a position teaching English really a completely different case?  Best wishes, Clive Clive Teaching English

	paco2004  +  193066 Mon, 06 Feb 06 05:38 AM Hello CJ Thank you for the suggestion. I can rather easily explain the grammar of your sentence with a rule of WHIZ deletion (clause contraction): "The book contained only two paragraphs (which were) explaining the cause of the Civil War". But in the case of my sentence, we need a "queer WHIZ deletion" to explain its grammaticality. "She found a position (which involved) teaching English at a high school". So I have a feeling this sort of phrase, "a position/a job/work --ing",  might be one of ungrammatical idiomatic constructs created by current English speakers. paco paco2004 Grammar, Clauses, Contractions, Paragraphs, Teaching English