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Yoong Liat

#274496 Sat, 30 Sep 06 11:45 AM

I say: Contrary to what you said all the books agree on all the topics except a couple of them.

1. Actually, to be fair, that's what I did say, although I accept that perhaps my wording was a little ambiguous and the meaning was implied rather than explicit. I apologise for not being clearer. Fundamentally, most texts agree on a the basic tenets of the language, but there are enough gaps or controversial areas of disagreement (particularly when it comes to usage) to cause significant headaches; especially at a more advanced level of study.

Now the picture is clearer. We are saying the same thing.

2. I do not know wish to question whether the British Council teachers are authorities on English because although the minimum specified qualification for working as a BC teacher, according to you, is a CELTA, they should have other English qualifications to be selected as a teacher. I think we should respect them for having a vast knowledge of English. Otherwise, they wouldn't be answering questions from the members of the public. When I refer to BC teachers, I was actually referring to the ones selected to answer questions from public members.

I think you should close this chapter and proceed to more meaningful discussions on other subjects.

Yoong Liat

Joined on Mon, Sep 4 2006

Singapore

Veteran Member (6,085)

Yoong Liat

CELTA

Saiing

#275135 Mon, 02 Oct 06 01:38 AM

Yoong Liat wrote:
2. I do not know wish to question whether the British Council teachers are authorities on English because although the minimum specified qualification for working as a BC teacher, according to you, is a CELTA,

Not according to me. According to the British Council. (check their website if you want to be sure).

Yoong Liat wrote:
they should have other English qualifications to be selected as a teacher.

You would think so wouldn't you? But, no. With the greatest respect, how many British Council teachers do you know, and how much information do you know about their qualifications? I'm not trying to argue with you about this, but really they're not the highly qualified academics you seem to think they are. I'm not trying to be deliberately insulting to BC teachers. I'm just telling you the truth of the situation.

Yoong Liat wrote:
I think we should respect them for having a vast knowledge of English. Otherwise, they wouldn't be answering questions from the members of the public. When I refer to BC teachers, I was actually referring to the ones selected to answer questions from public members.

All teachers answer questions from the public. That's what teachers do. I'm slightly confused by what you're trying to say. Really, although I think it's an endearing quality, you seem to have an impression of BC teachers which isn't quite in line with the reality of the situation. They're not stupid, but neither are they the pantheon of knowledge you are crediting them with being.

Saiing

Joined on Wed, Sep 20 2006

New Member (46)

CELTA

Yoong Liat

#275291 Mon, 02 Oct 06 01:40 PM

You seem to know so much about the BC teachers. May I know how you come to the conclusion that they're not the highly qualified academics? Are you saying that they do not have a degree in English? You think they are not so qualified. Have you worked with them before and for how long? And how many BC teachers do you know since you seem to imply you know a lot of them.

Yoong Liat

Clive

#275448 Mon, 02 Oct 06 10:55 PM

Hi guys,

I'd like to make a comment about degrees in English.

When I obtained my TESL teaching certificate, it was a post-graduate course. Several of my new classmates were young, recent graduates with degrees in English. The TESL course focussed mainly on the theory and methodology of teaching, but naturally there was a large component that involved grammar.

To my surprise, several of my classmates with English degrees had significant problems with grammar. This suggested to me that many English degrees today concentrate on literary analysis rather than grammar. In my opinion, the problem was compounded by the fact that high schools, at least where I live, no longer teach grammar thoroughly and intensively.

It's certainly not my intention to be disrespectful of the many accomplishments of people who have degrees in English. However, I don't feel that such a degree per se is always proof of expertise in grammar.

Best wishes, Clive

Clive

Joined on Thu, Oct 28 2004

Canada

Veteran Member (22,188)

El tango argentino es un pensamiento triste que se puede bailar (The tango argentino is a sad thought which can be danced) Enrique Santos Discépolo

Grammar

Saiing

#275484 Tue, 03 Oct 06 01:37 AM

Yoong Liat wrote:
You seem to know so much about the BC teachers. May I know how you come to the conclusion that they're not the highly qualified academics? Are you saying that they do not have a degree in English? You think they are not so qualified. Have you worked with them before and for how long? And how many BC teachers do you know since you seem to imply you know a lot of them.

Forgive me Yoong Liat. I'm really not that interested in bashing the British Council (especially being a Brit myself). They do a great job, and contribute widely to the education of non-native speakers in the language.

I just find it amusing that you seem to be convinced that BC teachers are almost akin to English demi-gods, striding Goliath-like through the troublesome world of English grammar, crushing everything before them with their towering intellects. The only point I've been making all along is that (and you're just going to have to take my word for it), they are just ordinary teachers, with a relatively minimal amount of training compared to say a properly qualified classroom teacher in a British school. Most of the folks who work for the BC are allowed to be sent abroad to teach in foreign classrooms, but wouldn't be allowed to teach in a high school back home.

Saiing

Grammar, English grammar

Yoong Liat

#275523 Tue, 03 Oct 06 04:39 AM

Hello Siiang

You say "Most of the folks who work for the BC are allowed to be sent abroad to teach in foreign classrooms, but wouldn't be allowed to teach in a high school back home." Why do you say 'most', not 'all'. Are you implying that at least a few of them at the British Council are qualified enough to teach in a high school? Would I be correct to say that the teacher selected to answer English queries from members of the public via email are qualified enough? I'm not referring to teachers who teach Singaporeans in the classrooms.

I would like you to clarify.

Hello Clive

I agree with you. A person with a degree in English may not have a good command of grammar. I know from personal experience that this is true. But what I wanted to emphasise is that the BC teachers are armed with qualifications which enable them to answer questions on grammar and English usage. However, Siiang says most (not all) of the BC teachers are not qualified enough. This is certainly news to me.

Yoong Liat

Grammar

Saiing

#275532 Tue, 03 Oct 06 05:08 AM

Yoong Liat wrote:
Hello Siiang

Hello Loong Yait! Big Smile [:D]

Yoong Liat wrote:
You say "Most of the folks who work for the BC are allowed to be sent abroad to teach in foreign classrooms, but wouldn't be allowed to teach in a high school back home." Why do you say 'most', not 'all'. Are you implying that at least a few of them at the British Council are qualified enough to teach in a high school?

Absolutely... That would be the normal implication you could draw from the word "most".

Yoong Liat wrote:
Would I be correct to say that the teacher selected to answer English queries from members of the public via email are qualified enough? I'm not referring to teachers who teach Singaporeans in the classrooms.

I've no idea. I don't know who they choose to perform such activities. One would certainly hope that they have sufficient knowledge of the language to be able to do the job effectively.

Yoong Liat wrote:
However, Siiang says most (not all) of the BC teachers are not qualified enough. This is certainly news to me.

That's not actually what I said. They're perfectly qualified enough to be BC teachers, because that's what they are. What I disagreed with, was your assertion that BC teachers are an "authority" on the English language, when in fact no such thing exists.

Saiing

Yoong Liat

#275571 Tue, 03 Oct 06 06:24 AM

Yoong Liat wrote:

Would I be correct to say that the teacher selected to answer English queries from members of the public via email are qualified enough? I'm not referring to teachers who teach Singaporeans in the classrooms.

Saiing wrote:

I've no idea. I don't know who they choose to perform such activities. One would certainly hope that they have sufficient knowledge of the language to be able to do the job effectively.

Thanks for the clarification. My contention is that the teacher selected to answer queries from the members of the public via email is qualified enough to attend to queries.

I'm not referring to teachers who teach in the classrooms.

Although I believe that the teacher attending to queries is an authority on English, I do not, for a moment, think he or she knows everything.

Yoong Liat

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