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Should Taiwan be part of China?

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Guest  #101846  Sun, 22 May 05 06:02 AM
i definitely disagree with people that thinks taiwan is not part of china. one obvious difference: not communist. why would china want taiwan, we are so small compare to china. all the chinese government want is power. like other people said, taiwanese people are not stupid, okay, it's true that the elders are dead. shouldn't the young ones live how they feel. why should we live based on what our grandparents want. are they ones who go to work everyday and be able to express their feelings without the government enforcing them. why should we live in an environment where we can believe what we want and live how we feel without people breathing down our neck. if you live in taiwan, and want taiwan to be part of china, i said go live in china. hey, their have bunch of lands... taiwan is not being benefit if it becomes part of china. so chinese government go take care your people first.. go feed the babies that are dying of hunger... stop trying to gain power. just leave us alone. stupid commist.....
  
Ja-Mez  #105180  Fri, 03 Jun 05 07:55 AM
I've notice, on the sidebar on the homepage, where it lists all the countries that are home to EnglishForums users, it says: "Taiwan, Province of China." Could the head of this forum kindly remove that "Province of China" part from it. Let's not put the cart in front of the horse.
  
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Josh2005  #110473  Sun, 19 Jun 05 02:47 AM
I would like to talk about the Taiwan/China issue from several perspectives. But first of all, please remove the "province of China" part, as Ja-Mez suggested, because it presupposes a certain standpoint and thus provides a biased environment for this discussion.

My first point is historical, namely "what was the relationship between Taiwan and China before?" The history after 1945 seems much more easier to understand--basically it is just a story in which the KMT retreated to Taiwan after its defeat in Mainland China and established a new polity on the island. Over the years it has had multiple disputes with Mainland China internationally over its own legitimacy. Undeniably, since 1945, the sovereignty of Mainland China has never been present in Taiwan. No matter what Mainland China says, it does not rule Taiwanese people. That's for sure.
So why is Taiwan a province of China? Being a province means being subordinated to the sovereignty of a centralized or federal government, which is not the case in Taiwan apparently. That's why I ask for removing "province of China" from the current title of Taiwan.
let us go back to historical facts. Yes, at least as early as the Ming Dynasty, Taiwan was included in the territory of China. Actually some officials of the Ching Dysnasty really did something in Taiwan, like paving the railroad and setting up some basic infrastructure. However, compared to other provinces in China at that time, the Ching Dynasty's sovereignty in Taiwan was relatively weak as it was just an island far away from the power center of China, then Peking. That's why Taiwanese people really recognized the convenience of modernization for the first time when they were colonized by Japanese after 1895. However, being colonized also stimulated some new thoughts about Taiwanese selves and identities. While some people transformed themselves into Japanese, some anticolonists turned to either China or Taiwan as their future detemination. I have to clarify here a fact that at that time, Taiwan or China was just a purely political image to affliate themselves to. It was established because of colonist oppression. That does not mean these people really wanted to become Chinese or Taiwanese; they just didn't want to become Japanese. Some historians even claim that for the first time in history Taiwanese people had their own sense of "togetherness" in the face of Japanese colonists, which turned into a primitive form of nationalism in Taiwan later.

Here comes my second point, a political one: When can a nation be called as such? Scholars trace back the origin of nationalism to the idea of "imagined community", that is, a sense of being together as a community among a bunch of people. They do not have to be geographically close, but the sense contributes to the formation of a new national identity. (Remember the Braveheart played by Mel Gibson? The image of a national hero is usually such a way). However, on a very practical scale, Taiwanese people have formed a very distinct national identity from that of the Chinese people. This is not my B-S. Please refer to Melissa Brown's "Is Taiwan Chinese?" (Stanford Unviersity Press, 2004) for relevant theorization. Politically, Taiwan and China are separate countries because they don't have the same identity. Identity, as Brown claims in her work, comes from living experiences together. (It is a simple extension of the anthropological concept, acculturation.) Since there has been many decades of separation between Taiwan and China, there is no common living experience upon which a shared identity can be established.

My third, and final, point will be stated from a social perspective. Since in recent years there have been many interactive activities going on across the Strait, the so-called life experience in both places may be more and more alike. Besides, economic progress and political change in Mainland China may transfigure it into a more compatible polity for Taiwanese people, and then reunification will be possible as long as Taiwanese people feel it acceptable. However, if the Mainland China stays politically authoritarian and diplomatically unfriendly to Taiwan, the Taiwan Independence is surely becoming a truth. That being said, I guess the biggest issue at stake is whether Mainland China can metamorphose into a politically democratic and economically balanced country, and this is still to be observed.

I am not saying Taiwan will never be a province of China, but I am saying it is NOT right now. I am not supposing a certain outcome (either reunification or separation), but proposing a way of peace across the Strait. There might be no definite answer to it, but the answer may take generations to reach.

Sorry for such a long article and probable grammatical errors or unintentional typos. Love and Peace!!
  
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Anonymous  #124978  Mon, 08 Aug 05 04:23 PM
I agree with you that the opinions of the people in Taiwan are fairly important,however I gotta say we should also listen to what people in mainland China think.I guess you haven't read any history about the relationship between mainland China and Taiwan island properly,Taiwan has never been a colony of  China,it was a colony of  Netherland and Japan.Then it was seprated again in 1949 as a result of Chinese civil war.Over this 55 years both people in Mainland&Taiwan have been brainwashed by thier own governments respectively.So to be honest,it not a wise choice to asked what people think because they don't know the truth.Personally,I think just let it go naturally and they will be united they were together for thousand years.
  
Anonymous  #130460  Thu, 25 Aug 05 02:38 AM
no. i do not think taiwan should be a part of china. they deserve their freedom.
  
Ja-Mez  #131234  Sat, 27 Aug 05 12:59 PM
Hmm this is like my 3rd post in this thread, but whatever, I'm Taiwanese, so this is my turf. Big Smile [:D]

Again I'm reiterating my stance that Taiwan should not be a part of China. Why it shouldn't be has been backed up by myself and other posters in this thread many times. So it's obvious that Taiwan is not a part of China, looking at historical facts, etc.

HOWEVER

Taiwan should not become an independent country. It is not in the best interests of the island to break away from the current "One Country, Two Policies" system. This is mainly because Taiwan depends on China so much to hold up its economy. Investments from Taiwan to China were at 100 billion last year, showing how much the little country depends on the mainland for economic support. Also, breaking away from China completely would probably set off a war, which nobody in the region--Korea (don't know about North Korea lol), Japan, Phillipines, etc--wants, and which the United States DEFINITELY does not want (incidentally, the USA is being a pain in the ***. George Bush is, unequivocally, an idiot and hypocrite. He does not want to anger Beijing, because of trade and economy issues. However, he has pledged his support to Taiwan, saying America will back up the little isle in the event of a war. What the hell? Conspiracy theorists also suggest Mr. Bush WANTS a war, to derail China's economy and reassure America that it will remain the global economic power--since China's economy is growing so fast Jesse Owens couldn't keep up with it). Taiwan also needs to be mindful that its citizens really are of Chinese heritage, and denying those citizens the opportunity to go to the motherland and see their history would not be desired.

And that's all.



  
Anonymous  #132961  Thu, 01 Sep 05 09:06 PM

"The United States of America recognizes the Government of the People's Republic of China as the sole legal government of China. Within this context, the people of the United States will maintain cultural, commercial, and other unofficial relations with the people of Taiwan ... The Government of the United States of America acknowledges the Chinese position that there is but one China and Taiwan is part of China"

that is what the USA thinks.

end of discussion.

  
Anonymous  #133061  Fri, 02 Sep 05 05:36 AM
Dear Mr/Mrs/Ms Anonymous,

 Firstly, you have not provided a source for your quote. Did you write it yourself? If not, please provide a source.

 Secondly, assuming the quote does represent U.S. policy, how does that make it the end of the discussion? Since when has the U.S. officially been the world's judge, jury and executioner?

Thanks for your input anyway :-)

  
Anonymous  #136804  Tue, 13 Sep 05 01:27 AM
Holly ***.. Taiwan is definitely a part of China. They share the Chinese culture, speak the chinese language.  They got everything from China. Of course it is a part of the mainland.
  
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