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Simple past or past perfect?
Simple past or past perfect?
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infinity
#101370 Fri, 20 May 05 05:00 AM
Here is a situation:
I had lunch with Jenny yesterday. Today she called me and said she had a wonderful time with me.
Is it possible to use a past perfect tense here, as ‘she said she had had a wonderful time with me’?
Another situation;
Jenny was supposed to have lunch with Tom and Steve. But when she got to the restaurant, Steve wasn’t there. Tom said Steve went back to his office because there was something came up.
Later Jenny told that to Kerry,
“When I got there, Steve had already gone back to his office.”
Is it possible to use a simple past tense here? Also, is it supposed to be ‘Tome said Steve had gone back’ or ‘Tom said Steve has gone back to’?
Thanks in advance.
infinity
Joined on Sun, Apr 24 2005
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Tenses
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Past perfect
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Simple past
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Past tenses
pieanne
#101408 Fri, 20 May 05 09:36 AM
Hello, Infinity,
In your first situation, both "had" and "had had" are possible.
In the second one, I'd use a past perfect in both cases. This is a reported speech in the past, and the action of "going back to the office" is anterior to the other one, so you need "had gone back"
pieanne
Joined on Thu, Jan 20 2005
South of France ...But I'm Belgian!
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I'm glad to help, but I'm not a native! And please excuse my typos...
Past perfect
,
Simple past
Simple past past perfect
Past progressive/past simple
simple past
past perfect and/or simple past
No sooner + past simple
Past Simple or Past Perfect
past simple ...
simple past/past perfect
Past Perfect or Past Simple?
by the time + past perfect or simple past
simple past and past perfect
past simple or past progressive
infinity
#101422 Fri, 20 May 05 10:50 AM
Thanks Pieanne.
Doesn’t ‘I had had a good time’ imply that their good time was completely over, that they wouldn’t have a good tome again?
There is no logic behind this to back up my concept, but I just feel that way.
infinity
Past perfect
,
Simple past
pieanne
#101451 Fri, 20 May 05 12:07 PM
I don't think so, Infinity, and anyway THAT good time is completely over, since it's in the past... But maybe a native will have another opinion.
pieanne
Past perfect
,
Simple past
Mister Micawber
#101456 Fri, 20 May 05 12:20 PM
I'd use past perfect in all three cases myself. I use past perfect for one of the two past events if two simple pasts (together with whatever temporally descriptive words, like 'after', are present) do not make clear which event preceded the other.
Mister Micawber
Joined on Wed, Aug 4 2004
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'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master-- that's all.'
Past perfect
,
Simple past
infinity
#101658 Sat, 21 May 05 02:34 AM
Thanks Mister Micawber, and again pieanne.
So likewise you'd say, 'Steve couldn't make it because there had been something came up'?
infinity
Past perfect
,
Simple past
Mister Micawber
#101677 Sat, 21 May 05 03:46 AM
'Steve couldn't make it because
something came / had come
up', actually.
I don't think that past perfect is either preferred or necessary here, as it is clear from the context that 'coming up' preceded 'making it'.
Mister Micawber
Past perfect
,
Simple past
infinity
#101706 Sat, 21 May 05 09:21 AM
Thanks Msiter Micawber!
SO, on the same token, can you say this?
Tom told me that he came back from his trip to Italy three days ago.
Or it's better to use past perfect, to say 'he had come back from ...'?
infinity
Past perfect
,
Simple past
Mister Micawber
#101748 Sat, 21 May 05 03:49 PM
It is more formal to use the past perfect in reported speech, speaking of a previous event. I would suggest you use it in essay-writing, but not worry about it in conversation, as either is acceptable, and 'came' is probably the more common.
Mister Micawber
Conversations
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Past perfect
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