Ahn  +  422868 Mon, 24 Sep 07 10:50 AM 1) The September 11th attacks have not driven any rich democracy to reverse itself and make torture legal. But they have encouraged the bending of definitions and the turning of blind eyes. There is a greater readiness among governments that would never practise torture themselves to use information which less squeamish states have obtained—through torture. Start with definitions. Most civilised people squirm at the thought of putting suspected terrorists on the rack or pulling off toenails. What if that prisoner knew the whereabouts of a ticking bomb—maybe a biological, chemical or even nuclear one? Wouldn't a little sleep deprivation, sexual humiliation or even water-dunking be justified to save hundreds and perhaps thousands of lives? Whatever the law says, a lot of people seem to think so.   ->What does 'start with definitions' mean here?   2) Have the terrorist attacks of September 11th 2001 put a lasting dent in civil liberties? The first of a series begins this week with a look at torture ->What does 'put a lasting dent' mean here?   Ahn Joined on Thu, Mar 1 2007 South Korea Regular Member 507

	CalifJim  +  423042 Mon, 24 Sep 07 06:33 PM Of course the literal meaning of dent is a deformation of a solid substance.  If someone accidentally rams their car into yours, crumpling the steel a bit, you've now got a dent in your car -- and he probably does too! But dent is used figuratively in a number of ways.  I remember an amusing case where a woman known for her charitable work with the poor, when interviewed about it on television, said, "Maybe we can't save the world, but at least we can put a dent in it."  Naturally, she meant that we can't alleviate all poverty, but at least we can take some small steps to alleviate what we can, i.e., "put a dent in poverty" -- not "put a dent in the world", as the original statement seemed to say. CJ CalifJim Joined on Mon, Aug 2 2004 California Veteran Member 22,463 "There are no facts, only interpretations" - Nietzsche