milky  +  110186 Sat, 18 Jun 05 02:54 AM Two texts with different tense, but giving the same information. 1. Fortuneteller: I see a great future in front of you. You pass your exam, go to university and do well. Then, you marry into money and become businesswoman of the year before 2012. 2. Fortuneteller: I see a great future in front of you. You will pass your exam, go to university and do well. Then, you will marry into money and become businesswoman of the year before 2012. Proposition: I say that the speaker has chosen the present simple in the first text because she/he wants to bring the predicted events (psychologically) closer (give them immediacy) and to make them appear more possible/factual. In the second text, the choice of "will" give less immediacy/factuality and the possibility is weaker. What do you think? NB: Remember that the graphic present is used to give the past more immediacy. I think that the present simple is working in a similar way in text 1. above. milky Joined on Thu, Jan 15 2004 Senior Member 3,149 Hume said that if we had perfect or complete descriptive knowledge of reality, we could not, by reasoning, derive a single valid "ought". Tenses, Universities, Present Simple

	Roro  +  110191 Sat, 18 Jun 05 04:08 AM Hi milky. (Have you given up our discussion on modal auxiliaries?) Tense is used for more than just time I think it's a good point. Quine once said: Our ordinary language shows a tiresome bias in its treatment of time. Relations of date are exalted grammatically (..). This bias is of itself an inelegance, or breach of theoretical simplicity. Moreover, the form it takes ??that of requiring that every verb form show a tense??is peculialy productive of needless complications, since it demands lip service to time even when time is farthest from our thoughts. (Quine1960:170) Seems you shares your view with Quine, don't you? I can understand now Quine's statement. Granted that his and your point make good sense, I'd give your examples different descriptions. Exapmle 1: this usage of simple present tense is similar to its usge for . (Have you ever seen any scenarios which are not written in simple present tense?) Exapmle 2: Future tense. These sentences describe events which will take place in some future world. (I'm not so sure: Have I missed your point ..?) Roro Joined on Mon, Apr 11 2005 Regular Member 581 Verbs, Auxiliaries, Tenses, Modals, Dates, Present Tenses, Modal Auxiliaries, Simple Present

	milky  +  110213 Sat, 18 Jun 05 08:38 AM Exapmle 1: this usage of simple present tense is similar to its usge for . (Have you ever seen any scenarios which are not written in simple present tense?) That's good. I hadn't thought of scenarios. Thanks. Love the quote. milky Tenses, Present Tenses, Simple Present

	milky  +  110221 Sat, 18 Jun 05 09:30 AM Just found this: The present tense is what you should use to sell your story to an editor. Authors use it to write their synopses; critics and essayists write about great historical personas and events in it; and centuries after playwrights have passed on, we still speak of their characters using it. The present tense lends authority, importance, life. Use it to tell facts, regular (i.e., repetitive) action, and to show in-the-moment action. http://www.eharlequin.com.au/learn_grammar_tense.shtml So the fortuneteller is selling her "story". milky Tenses, Present Tenses

	Roro  +  110227 Sat, 18 Jun 05 09:58 AM I don't think Cathy Witlox's description is a good one, to be frank with you. We should distinguish the usage of simple present from its usage, in the first place. Roro Tenses, Simple Present

	milky  +  110237 Sat, 18 Jun 05 10:41 AM > Doesn't she go part way to that? 1. Use it to tell facts, regular (i.e., repetitive) action, 2. and to show in-the-moment action. milky Tenses

	Roro  +  110239 Sat, 18 Jun 05 11:01 AM It's too . On one hand we use it to tell facts, regular (i.e., repetitive) action. We use it also to show in-the-moment action deictically, as if reporting some event, on the other. In 1 there's no reference to any particular event. In 2 there is. Roro Tenses