We have partnered with TradePub to bring you free industry magazines and resources - no coupons or credit cards required!

Visit: englishforums.tradepub.com


Share this topic:
This question is Not Answered
Latest post Wed, Oct 15 2008 12:28 AM by Raen. 5 replies.
Suggest an answer | | |
Raen  +  576345 Tue, 14 Oct 08 06:38 PM

Do we say,

This is a tricky matter to handle. Or,

This is a tricky matter to be handled. Thanks.

 

Raen

Joined on Thu, May 1 2008
Full Member 354
Fandorin  +  576361 Tue, 14 Oct 08 07:26 PM

Hi,Raen
Raen

Do we say,

This is a tricky matter to handle. It's Ok." to handle" here shows destination of "matter" (in function of attributive).

He brought some water to drink. "Water for what?" -  "to drink"

T. his is a tricky matter to be handled. It's also OK. Matter will be handled. It emphasises that someone is going to struggle with it to handle.


Raen

Joined on Thu, Dec 20 2007
Moscow
Contributing Member 1,382
Whatever happens, be yourself.
Raen  +  576418 Tue, 14 Oct 08 10:56 PM

Hi Fandorin, thank you for your reply. But I'm afraid I don't quite get the difference you pointed out. I'd appreciate it if you could explain furthur. You said:

Fandorin

This is a tricky matter to handle. It's Ok." to handle" here shows destination of "matter" (in function of attributive).

What do you mean by "destination of "matter"'?

My confusion lays on the seemingly absence of subject that does the action of the transitive verb "handle". "This" (the subject) in the sentence is "the matter" which is the object that recieves the action "handle". We would say: This (the matter) is to be handled. For a matter doesn't perform an action (handled), rather it is performed an action on. Therefore my question has come to be..is it "to handle" or "to be handled"?

 

It would be nice if a native speaker could verify this. Thanks.

 

Raen

 

 

Goodman  +  576425 Tue, 14 Oct 08 11:33 PM

Hi Raen,

In order to learn how natural English is used, sometimes, we have to learn to use them  in a broader context, rather than in limited terms.

‘Handle- can be used both actively and passively, depending on the context.

Many verbs used in the passive voice don't require a agent (a subject, as you referred) 

This project should be handled with careful plannning.- no agent
The paintings were damaged becasue they weren't handled carefully during the moving (by the mover). Either with or without agent is ok.

This project is too big for John to handle by him self. – Active voice, meaning it may be beyond his ability to manage the project alone. He may need help.

 

This operation is too delicate to be handled by a rookie – This is a passive sentence.

This operation is too delicate for a rookie to handle- This is an equivalent statement in active voice.

Both are fine, in my opinion.


Hope this helps 

Joined on Mon, Nov 7 2005
Senior Member 3,816
The name says it all!
CalifJim  +  576429 Wed, 15 Oct 08 12:00 AM
Raen

This is a tricky matter to handle. Or,

This is a tricky matter to be handled.

The first.  The person who will be handling the matter is omitted from the non-finite for ... to ... clause.  Thus, the "full form" is:

This is a tricky matter for [someone / a person / anyone] to handle (*it). 

Likewise,

It's an awful thing to say.  >> It's an awful thing for someone to say (*it).

That's a difficult song to sing. >> That's a difficult song for someone to sing (*it).

That's a good book to read.  >> That's a good book for someone to read (*it).

With a personal subject: 

Ellen was looking for a new recipe to try.  >> Ellen was looking for a new recipe (*for Ellen herself to try (*it)).

Jake wanted a warmer coat to wear in cold weather. >> Jake wanted a warmer coat (*for Jake himself to wear (*it) in cold weather.)

Fran needed an interesting magazine to take on the plane. >> Fran needed an interesting magazine (*for Fran herself to take (*it) on the plane). 

If the subject of the for ... to ... clause is not the same as the subject of the sentence, it must be specified explicitly:

Ellen was looking for a new recipe for her sister to try.

Jake wanted a warmer coat for his mother to wear in cold weather.

Fran needed an interesting magazine for the children to take on the plane. 

Implied person in certain constructions:

(Handing money to someone) Here's some money to spend.  >> Here's some money for you to spend (*it). 

CJ 

 

 

Joined on Mon, Aug 2 2004
California
Veteran Member 22,395
"There are no facts, only interpretations" - Nietzsche
Raen  +  576434 Wed, 15 Oct 08 12:28 AM

Thanks to Goodman and Jim, I've got it now. The structure can be both in passive and active voices. Thanks again for the thorough explanations, I appreciate it.

 

Raen

© MediaCet Ltd. 2009, v5.0.3607.32596. All content posted by our users is a contribution to the public domain, this does not include imported usenet posts.*
For web related enquires please contact us on webmaster@mediacet.com, status updates are available at status.mediacet.com.
*Usenet post removal: Use 'X-No-Archive'. You may not have understood that your posts would end up in the public domain. Please send proof of the poster's email, we will remove immediately.