Anonymous  +  461003 Sun, 06 Jan 08 08:45 AM I'd be happy if someone would answer my question. Thanks in advance. Are the following 3 sentences all correct? If so, what's the difference? I think in A "until now" is redundant. A:  We have been here since 7 o'clock until now. B:  We have been here since 7 o'clock. C:  We have been here from 7 o'clock until now. Anonymous

	Best answer by Grammar Geek  +  461145 Sun, 06 Jan 08 02:42 PM The "until now" is redundant. The use of the present perfect "We have been here" says that you are still there. B is the superior choice. If you were no longer "there" then say "We were there from 7 o'clock until 10." Grammar Geek Present Tenses, Present Perfect

	Best answer by CalifJim  +  461342 Mon, 07 Jan 08 05:41 AM My mistake.  I, too, mistakenly read the sentence as ... since 7 o'clock until now.  It was that construction I called redundant -- or believed at the time that I was calling redundant.  But no matter.  The version with ... from 7 o'clock until now is equally redundant, in my opinion.  The present perfect already means until now.  All variants with from are inferior to those with since. The only version that is completely idiomatic to my ear is We have been here since 7 o'clock. CJ CalifJim

	Yoong Liat  +  461149 Sun, 06 Jan 08 02:49 PM When 'since' is used 'until now' should not be used. We have been here since 7 o'clock. I have been a teacher since 1990. Yoong Liat Joined on Mon, Sep 4 2006 Veteran Member 6,757

	Yoong Liat  +  461177 Sun, 06 Jan 08 04:00 PM  Anonymous wrote: Is C wrong or just awkward? C is definitely wrong. As I saud earlier, when 'since' is used, 'until now' should never be in the sentence because 'since' refers to the past till the present. I hope my explanation is clear. Yoong Liat

	CalifJim  +  461297 Mon, 07 Jan 08 02:06 AM Is C wrong or just awkward? Actually, I would not call C either wrong or awkward.  I would call it redundant.  Most redundant expressions are perfectly grammatical; they're just not good in terms of style. CJ CalifJim Joined on Mon, Aug 2 2004 California Veteran Member 22,465 "There are no facts, only interpretations" - Nietzsche

	Yoong Liat  +  461298 Mon, 07 Jan 08 02:11 AM C:  We have been here from 7 o'clock until now. I said C is definitely wrong because I thought 'since' was used in the above sentence. That's why I replied "When 'since' is used 'until now' should not be used" and gave the following sentences. We have been here since 7 o'clock. I have been a teacher since 1990. C:  We have been here from 7 o'clock until now. (As 'since' is not used here, the sentence is not wrong, as CJ has pointed out. However, as it is a long-winded way, the 'since' version should, in my opinion, be used instead.)   Yoong Liat