Hi,

Trying to find information on what other people think about Germany, I came across this interestring conversation...

I grew up in Southern Germany, in the Lake Constance area, in a traditionally German family. It was not until I spent a year in the US that I started to really think about what makes up our great nation and I think many Germans who haven't lived abroad as I have still are not aware of what a great country they call they home. If you would ask anyone on the streets what it means to be German, or what Germany is, you'd hardly get any reasonably good answers.
Especially among Germany's youth - to which I belong - the awareness and understanding for one's own country is very limited.

As mentioned before, Germans hardly have any sense of pride and if they do, they tend to avoid showing it - e.g. the examples with the flags in the front yard. One would be afraid to be called a Nazi. In my opinion, this is just stupid - and sad! There's no reason whatsoever why Germans should be less proud of their country, their culture, their traditions, their people. Yes, of course, there's WW II and no one is proud of what happened at that time. However, this is not my fault nor my parents' and other nations have black spots in their history as well (What about the American-native American relationship, Japanese American, the Chinese and the Tibetians and so on). Well, anyway, this is not the post's topic, but for foreigners, it might be hard to understand...

What is Germany then? Well, first of all, I think Germany is a very old country with a long and interesting history that was made possible by many great men and women. Germany's sons and daughters include many important artist (Albrecht Dürer, Paul Klee, Andreas Feiniger just to name a few), many important musicians (Bach, Schumann, Wagner...), many important architects (Gropius, Neumann...), scientists (Einstein, Koch, Planck) and other famous people. In many areas or research, the Germans have been an important key in the chain of development, e.g. cars, rockets, medicine...
Also, the German cuisine is well-known all over the world and has much more to it than just sauerkraut and sausage. There are many unique meals, pastries, breads...
Culture and traditions still plays an important role in everyday life. From my experience, Germans go to museums, art shows or play more often then Americans and they have traditions going back many centuries.

Germany is a very diverse nation. Not only geographically - stretching for the northern Alps to the Baltic and North Sea, but also ethnically. There are people from many different cultures living in this country. Many of them are European immigrants, especially from Eastern Europe and Turkey. They make up an important part of Germany population nowadays and they have a great impact on German culture and politics.

Also, in my opinion, Germany is a very progressive nation. Did you know that the mayor of Germany's capital, Klaus Wowereit, outed himself as gay? Gay marriages are legal since a couple of years and so is abortion. Only few people - compared to nations like the US or Italy - are practising their religion on a regular basis. It is much more important to many people to have a good job and a comfortable life. This is also true for women, who tend to prefer a career to family. The legal status of abortion in Germany makes this a lot easier for them.

There would be so much more to say but I gotta go now, sorry.
Love, Theedee

Erm...Mahlzeit! I read this discussion with interest as I have recently written a paper on "wie "deutsch" sind die Deutschen" and I am in the process of trying to make it better. It hasn't been easy as German isn't my first language, and I really hate it when people take it upon themeselves to be experts on nationalities and say, "Oh you are (eg.) American therefore you are so x, y and z". Stereotypes are so dull aren't they?

So , what do you consider to be "German"? Its so difficult to define without relying on stereotypes. I personally think that nationality is mostly defined by others. If I was to sit around trying to define my own nationality it would boil down to navel-gazing and I would come to the conclusion that we are all individuals influenced in some ways by the culture that we were born and brought up in.

I really don't think that there are great differences between say Britain and Germany in general terms as both nations have similar traditions, similar language, religion etc. There are definite differences between say Japan and Germany because there are definite differences in cluture and tradition.

Could anyone define "German" for me, and does anyone have any ideas on what it is that defines German-ness?

It seems odd to be either proud or ashamed of the place where you were born, or of what people did before you were born.

Do the carpet mites in my bedroom feel superior to the carpet mites in the hall, I wonder.

MrP