CalifJim  +  78609 Sat, 05 Mar 05 07:35 AM Do you seriously not know the difference between "X means Y" and "X sometimes contains the meaning of Y within it"? You are deliberately being obtuse, Terry. CJ CalifJim Joined on Mon, Aug 2 2004 California Veteran Member 22,415 "There are no facts, only interpretations" - Nietzsche Difference Between

	just the truth  +  78628 Sat, 05 Mar 05 09:42 AM Jim wrote: Do you seriously not know the difference between "X means Y" and "X sometimes contains the meaning of Y within it"? That was the point of my posting, Jim. I believe that this has been misanalysed. I believe that has no connection to , none at all. Normally, because double modals are not allowed in English, when one chooses to use or , with modal meanings that are decidedly different from , a change has to be made to a periphrastic modal, which in this case is . We disagree. It isn't the end of the world. I can live with it and I think you can too. just the truth Joined on Mon, Dec 27 2004 Regular Member 849 Modals, Difference Between

	equivocal  +  78673 Sat, 05 Mar 05 01:30 PM I don't beleive that it is proper to say that a modal has a past "tense." Modals can not be inflected for tense. Dear Cacarr, modals can be inflected for tense but only syntactic tense. equivocal Joined on Tue, Mar 1 2005 Junior Member 58 Tenses, Modals

	equivocal  +  78675 Sat, 05 Mar 05 01:39 PM I'm not sure anyone has actually compiled a set of "rules" There are many good books (and not so good books) on modal logic. Works by David Lewis such as On the plurality of worlds and a general search on "modal logic" would yield decent results. eq equivocal Modals

	just the truth  +  78697 Sat, 05 Mar 05 03:25 PM Dear Cacarr, modals can be inflected for tense but only syntactic tense. I'd be interested in seeing some of those "inflections", equivocal. just the truth Tenses, Modals, Inflections

	CalifJim  +  78723 Sat, 05 Mar 05 05:42 PM Hi, eq, My reference to rules was to rules found in elementary textbooks of English as a foreign language. You know the sort of thing: Subjects and verbs must agree in number. How to use apostrophe-S. I wasn't expecting students to study mathematics or anything quite so rigorous as you are suggesting! I see a distinct difference between "modal logic" with its P(x) = ~N(~x), etc. and a "rule" which helps a student decide how to fill in the blank below. I thought I _______ go to the party with Tim. (could, would, may, might, will, can, ...) Even if there is a relationship between the formulas and the practical choices, it's not clear to me that a mastery of one would result in a mastery of the other. Jim CalifJim Verbs, Modals, Difference Between, Apostrophes

	cacarr  +  78756 Sat, 05 Mar 05 09:23 PM That's interesting, equivical. What is the nature of the inflection? Tense is a morphological thing: Smoke -Present Tense Smoked -Past Tense Will smoke = future time. See that the verb is without an affix of any kind? There is no future tense in English. We use a modal to refer to future time. Could Coulded? Would Woulded? cacarr Joined on Sat, Mar 5 2005 New Member 33 Verbs, Tenses, Modals, Past Tenses, Inflections, Present Tenses, Affix

	Casi  +  78795 Sun, 06 Mar 05 01:34 AM Eq: modals can be inflected for tense but only syntactic tense. Excellent point, Eq, and it feeds well into the discussion, but I'm not sure every one here is familiar with the term syntactic tense. Casi Joined on Sat, Sep 25 2004 Regular Member 547 Tenses, Modals