Whose property?

1 5 6 7 8 10 11 12 13 15
   Share on Facebook  
Cool Breeze  #296297  Wed, 22 Nov 06 12:55 PM
 Milky wrote:

 Cool Breeze wrote:


I agree with you completely. I am a good example of a person who, just like native speakers of English, expects people to speak English. What choice do I have? I don't speak Greek, the Greeks don't speak Finnish, so when I arrive at a hotel in Athens, I speak English to the receptionist.

Cheers
CB

And how do you feel if the receptionist doesn't speak English?


I have no idea. That has never happened. I should think such a hotel would have few international customers.

Cheers
CB
  
Top 50 Contributor
Joined on Fri, Apr 7 2006
Helsinki, Finland
Senior Member (2,857)
Proficient SpeakerTrusted Users
The coldest winter I ever spent was a summer in San Francisco.- Mark Twain
MrPedantic  #296489  Thu, 23 Nov 06 12:13 AM
 Milky wrote:

“Foreign language instruction at any level should be a humanistic pursuit intended to sensitize students to other cultures, to the relativity of values, to appreciation of similarities among peoples and respect for the differences among them.” (Wilkes, p. 107)

If I sign up for evening classes in Polish, I don't want to spend my two hours a week being subjected to (no doubt well-meaning but essentially) patronising clichés. I just want to learn Polish.

MrP

  
Top 10 Contributor
Joined on Tue, Oct 12 2004
Veteran Member (12,053)
Proficient SpeakerSystemAdministrator
...opella forensis / adducit febris...
milky  #296576  Thu, 23 Nov 06 06:56 AM

<If I sign up for evening classes in Polish, I don't want to spend my two hours a week being subjected to (no doubt well-meaning but essentially) patronising clichés. I just want to learn Polish.>

Does anyone know what Mr P meant by that statement? Is he saying that he wouldn't want to know anything about Polish culture?

  
Top 50 Contributor
Joined on Thu, Jan 15 2004
Senior Member (3,149)
Hume said that if we had perfect or complete descriptive knowledge of reality, we could not, by reasoning, derive a single valid "ought".
milky  #296696  Thu, 23 Nov 06 01:21 PM

Teacher's views vs. st¡udents views.

"As previously pointed out, the teaching of culture is seen as integral to school's mission. Several teachers who spend time discussing culture indicated that they discuss "mainstream elements" such as food, holidays, and clothing. They believe that any part of American culture is essential in the students' education and acculturation process. The teachers believe that with this knowledge, students will be better able to interact in the community and communicate more effectively.

Students expressed a similar feeling--that classes should include some cultural component, but their reasoning was somewhat different. They want explicit cultural lessons only as they relate to increasing proficiency. As one student said, "I am not concerned about culture except that it helps me know English. I think there should be some culture, but mostly English. Understand English more easily." The students appear much less overtly concerned about acclimating and more concerned with learning English."

  
MrPedantic  #296900  Thu, 23 Nov 06 10:38 PM
 Milky wrote:

<If I sign up for evening classes in Polish, I don't want to spend my two hours a week being subjected to (no doubt well-meaning but essentially) patronising clichés. I just want to learn Polish.>

Does anyone know what Mr P meant by that statement? Is he saying that he wouldn't want to know anything about Polish culture?

MrP means Polish culture, fine. Sunday-School-Teacherly tosh, not fine.

MrP

  
milky  #297017  Fri, 24 Nov 06 08:10 AM
 MrPedantic wrote:

MrP means Polish culture, fine. Sunday-School-Teacherly tosh, not fine.

MrP

What is he talking about? Any ideas?

This?

"The teacher is the image of Brahman (God)," say the laws of Manu (100-200 A.D.)

  
MrPedantic  #297342  Fri, 24 Nov 06 11:02 PM
 Milky wrote:
 MrPedantic wrote:

MrP means Polish culture, fine. Sunday-School-Teacherly tosh, not fine.

MrP

What is he talking about? Any ideas?

This?

"The teacher is the image of Brahman (God)," say the laws of Manu (100-200 A.D.)

No, not that. This, actually:

 A Sunday School Teacher wrote:

“Foreign language instruction at any level should be a humanistic pursuit intended to sensitize students to other cultures, to the relativity of values, to appreciation of similarities among peoples and respect for the differences among them.”

MrP

  
milky  #298027  Mon, 27 Nov 06 08:57 AM
 MrPedantic wrote:
 Milky wrote:
 MrPedantic wrote:

MrP means Polish culture, fine. Sunday-School-Teacherly tosh, not fine.

MrP

What is he talking about? Any ideas?

This?

"The teacher is the image of Brahman (God)," say the laws of Manu (100-200 A.D.)

No, not that. This, actually:

 A Sunday School Teacher wrote:

“Foreign language instruction at any level should be a humanistic pursuit intended to sensitize students to other cultures, to the relativity of values, to appreciation of similarities among peoples and respect for the differences among them.”

MrP

Grice's Conversational Maxims


 

Maxim of Quantity:

1. Make your contribution to the conversation as informative as necessary.
2. Do not make your contribution to the conversation more informative than necessary.


Maxim of Quality:

1. Do not say what you believe to be false.
2. Do not say that for which you lack adequate evidence.


Maxim of Relevance:

Be relevant (i.e., say things related to the current topic of the conversation).


Maxim of Manner:

1. Avoid obscurity of expression.
2. Avoid ambiguity.
3. Be brief (avoid unnecessary wordiness).
4. Be orderly.
  
MrPedantic  #298627  Tue, 28 Nov 06 09:20 PM

It's a pity he doesn't say anything about "consistency", Milky.

For instance:

Exhibit A: Milky deprecates the imposition of ideology in the classroom:

 Milky wrote:

<Learning English should be fun for all involved, not a battle to win hearts and minds... >

That statement should be the alma mater of all language teachers.

 

Exhibit B: Milky again deprecates the imposition of ideology in the classroom:

 Milky wrote:

Eurocentrism is the practice, conscious or otherwise, of placing emphasis on European (and, generally, Western) concerns, culture and values at the expense of those of other cultures.

Exhibit C: Milky staunchly advocates the imposition of ideology in the classroom:

 Milky wrote:

“Foreign language instruction at any level should be a humanistic pursuit intended to sensitize students to other cultures, to the relativity of values, to appreciation of similarities among peoples and respect for the differences among them.” (Wilkes, p. 107)

I agree, but how do you guarantee that teachers are objective in their pursuits?

MrP

  
1 5 6 7 8 10 11 12 13 15
AddThis Feed Button RSS Feed: ESL Linguistics Discussion Forum
© 2008 MediaCET Ltd.
Terms and Conditions & Terms of Service