ESL General English Grammar Questions

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Grammarian-bot — Wed, 16 Aug 2006 04:40:50 GMT

Well, i've come across this website which enlists plural nouns and categorizes them with respect to their form (singular or plural)

http://www2.gsu.edu/~wwwesl/egw/nouns/plural.htm

GB

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Anonymous — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:38:03 GMT

Feathers wrote:
Grammarian-bot wrote:
Inchoateknowledge wrote:
Police is a plural noun, can not have singular verb attached to it, thus not collective noun; army is a singular countable one.
There is no reason for why it is so.
BTW, I could not download the link.

So, it means that there are plural nouns that always take plural verbs. Can you give some other examples of plural nouns?

I had no idea, so I checked my grammar book.

cattle, clergy, people, police, poultry, ...

the New York Yankees, the Utah Jazz, ...

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Goodman — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:24:13 GMT

Obviously, depending on where we learned English, it has some bearing on our understanding toward some of the most common debated questions. To validate my own understanding, I did some searching and came to a conclusion, In the US, some experts agree that either singular or plural is acceptable, but must be consistently used in the context. However, the majority considers âPoliceâ as plural. In contrast, it seems that in Europe âpoliceâ is used as a singular noun. I learned something todayâ¦..

House Style Guide

The singular form packs a greater punch, but both are correct. ... Form plural possessives by adding an apostrophe to plural nouns ending in "s" (appellees' ...
courts.state.ar.us/courts/rd_style6.html - 58k - Cached - Similar pages

Unit 5. Singular, plural, and collective nouns

Collective nouns can be used with singular or plural verbs. ... WARNING: "Police" is a plural noun, but does not end in "-s". The police were informed ...

The Grammar Doctor's Tip Archive Page 7

My dictionary doesn't indicate whether it considers it singular or plural, but I still treat it as singular. Note that "police" is always plural, as is ...
www.grammardoctor.com/archive10.htm - 39k - Cached - Similar pages

Online Style Guide - P - Online Specials - Times Online
Whether singular or plural, always maintain consistency within a story ... Police Complaints Authority was replaced (April 2004) by the Independent Police ...
www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2941-576,00.html - Similar pages

[PDF] TSHIVENDA TSHIVENDA
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML
singular and plural, under one number, while others prefer the. international numbering. ... In less than ten years, the South African Police Service has ...

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Maple — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:18:48 GMT

Does an Oxford dict. say things in BrE? Well, it also suggests "police" should be used as a plural.

Hi, IK!

I think you can open the link if you get rid of the repetitive "http://" in the address column.

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Grammar Geek — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 17:28:41 GMT

I so often forget to include the caveat "in American English." I know the Brits have a different approach to some collective nouns (country, company, etc.) so it should be so with "police" as well. In American English, police is plural. Google results showed singular police used in other countries, and a great many hits for the musical group.

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Feathers — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 16:45:54 GMT

Grammarian-bot wrote:
Inchoateknowledge wrote:
Police is a plural noun, can not have singular verb attached to it, thus not collective noun; army is a singular countable one.
There is no reason for why it is so.
BTW, I could not download the link.

So, it means that there are plural nouns that always take plural verbs. Can you give some other examples of plural nouns?

I had no idea, so I checked my grammar book.

cattle, clergy, people, police, poultry, ...

the New York Yankees, the Utah Jazz, ...

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Goodman — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 16:41:47 GMT

GG,

Don't mean to disappoint your arguement. To affirm my own learning, I checked and found these:

Patrol Police is Set to Enhance the Security in Cyberjaya ... The Patrol Police adheres to the security standards of a Cybercity, whereby it takes a maximum ...

No doubt the Police has done more than enough to earn the scorn and ill-will of ... Itâs best known legend, The Police is your Friend (spelt enemy) has

The Dutch police consists of 25 regional police forces and the National Police ... Each of the Netherlands' 25 police regions is headed by a regional police ...

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Grammar Geek — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:56:48 GMT

I'm sorry, Goodman, but police takes the plural. The police force takes a singular, but you would never say "Police is questioning the suspect" or "The police is looking for clues to the crime."

You could say "A policeman is" or "The police force is" or "A member of the police" but not just "Police is."

I've never thought before why we think of the police as a bunch of individuals who therefore take the plural, but the army is usually taken as a singular unit. I'm sorry that I don't have a better answer as to why.

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Goodman — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:45:33 GMT

Inchoateknowledge wrote:
Police is a plural noun, can not have singular verb attached to it, thus not collective noun; army is a singular countable one.
There is no reason for why it is so.
BTW, I could not download the link.

I tend to disagree. Police is mostly considered and used as a singular collective noun unless itâs a situation where more than one police department is involved.

We can answer questions and donât mind doing so. However, learners may not retain the answers by memorization. Reading is the better method.

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Grammarian-bot — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 05:58:25 GMT

Inchoateknowledge wrote:
Police is a plural noun, can not have singular verb attached to it, thus not collective noun; army is a singular countable one.
There is no reason for why it is so.
BTW, I could not download the link.

So, it means that there are plural nouns that always take plural verbs. Can you give some other examples of plural nouns.

GB

Re: Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Inchoateknowledge — Mon, 14 Aug 2006 09:07:38 GMT

Police is a plural noun, can not have singular verb attached to it, thus not collective noun; army is a singular countable one.
There is no reason for why it is so.
BTW, I could not download the link.

Difference between aggregate and collective nouns

Grammarian-bot — Mon, 14 Aug 2006 08:06:38 GMT

http://www2.gsu.edu/~wwwesl/egw/nouns/plural.htm

According to the above mentioned website, Police is an aggregate noun.

The police are still looking for the Olympic Park bomber.

If it is so, then why army is always considered as a collective noun. What is the main difference between the two?

GB