ESL General English Grammar Questions

Re: as far as one's concerned

Anonymous — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 20:37:15 GMT

Hi Avangi,

I see! I appreciate all your help with the issues.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Avangi — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 19:45:57 GMT

It seems to go against what I previously said.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Anonymous — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 19:32:11 GMT

Hi Avangi,

Thank you very much for your detailed analysis of the issues.

What does 'to run counter to my advice' mean in your last post?

Many thanks.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Avangi — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 00:08:21 GMT

Anonymous
"As far as I'm concerned, she's qualified for the job." Does this show that the person is praising her?

Actually, yes. I'm glad you came up with this one, as it seems to run counter to my advice. I've heard it used in two ways:

(1) Opinions are being solicited following a discussion of the candidate's qualifications, and someone gives this reply. It has the flavor of, "I've made up my mind. No further discussion is necessary." In this case it's very close to "in my opinion," perhaps stressing even more that "This is the way I personally feel about it, even if others may disagree."

(2) (a little different) The speaker knows his opinion is contrary to the wishes of his colleagues, and he means to stress his opposition. Any "dismissiveness" here is directed at his colleagues, and not at the candidate.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Anonymous — Mon, 28 Apr 2008 19:10:46 GMT

Hi Avangi,

Many many thanks for all your helpful and great replies. You are so wonderful to do your best to help us. I appreciate it very much. I believe I have learned a lot from you.

"Your questions are excellent and show a good grasp of the issues"
Thank you very much for saying so, I feel flattered.

I have one more question about the issues. Can we use 'as far as I'm concerned' here, is it appropriate?

"As far as I'm concerned, she's qualified for the job.'
Does this show that the person is praising her?

Thank you very much for your opinion.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Avangi — Mon, 28 Apr 2008 00:00:17 GMT

Hi Anon,

Your questions are excellent and show a good grasp of the issues. You're pushing me to the limit of my knowledge on the subject, which is a good thing. My opinions are based more on a long lifetime of listening to people use the expressions, and less on reading about them in text books.

Clearly, the overall effect of these sentences depends on the "introductory expression," the message which follows, the previous context, and (if spoken) the inflection of the voice. The expression and the message have an influence on each other. You've shown that you understand this.

I agree with what you've said about the army example.

The teacher/student example is very interesting, because the expression is used in the second person as well as in the first person. (All three sentences are good.) To me, the student's reply comes across as rude [disrespectful] and argumentative. (I wonder if you thought of it in that way?) The student's position is contentious, and I doubt he could express it in a way that would not be offensive. Not only is he challenging the teacher's opinion; he's making it personal.

If you substituted "In your opinion/in my opinion" it would be somewhat less offensive. I can't honestly say that the difference lies in the "dismissiveness." Even if you simply say, "I thought the test was hard," you're in trouble, because you're challenging the teacher's judgment, not just a point of grammar, etc. "I had trouble with the test," is about as far as you can go. Maybe I'm just old fashioned.

In the flea example, all the insult seems to be carried in the main clause. I don't believe you could say the insult goes back and retroactively colors "in my opinion." But on the other hand, you can't say that the "neutral" nature of "in my opinion" in any way lessens the impact of the insult, which lies in the extreme exaggeration of the comparison to a flea brain.

"In my opinion, she's not qualified for the job," is not insulting at all. "As far as I'm concerned, she's not qualified for the job," makes it more personal than "in my opinion," and seems to imply that you have your own reasons for rejecting her, which may go beyond a purely objective "opinion." You just plain don't want her = dismissive.

Best wishes, - A.

Edit. It looks like I've contradicted myself. "The expression and the message have an influence on each other." "I don't believe you could say the insult goes back and retroactively colors in my opinion."

For now, let's just leave it that whether or not the message actually changes the impact of the introductory expression is open to discussion.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Anonymous — Sun, 27 Apr 2008 19:29:52 GMT

Hi Avangi and GG,

Many thanks for your clear expalantion and all your help!

1.In my opinion, you should join the Army. For all I know, you should join the Army. If you sincerely wish to advise your friend to join the Army, and you think it's in his best interest, which would you choose?

My answer is 'in my opinion'. It doen't seem right to use 'for all I know' here, ritht?

2."For all I know" sounds to me like what someone's opinion on a subject is just his wild guess without being based on any facts and as you said there's a flavor of cynicism, etc. Did I say that right?

3.'As far as I'm concerned also has a dismissive flavor'

Does it alway has dismissive flavor or it sometimes doesn't?

Teacher:The test I gave you last time was very simple.
Student:As far as you're concerned, it was. But as far as I'm concerned, it was hard.

Does this have any dismissive or sarcastic flavor? Are these sentences I made above correct?

4."In my opinion she doesn't have the brains God gave a flea."

Does 'in my opinion' here have any dismissive or insulting flavor? Or someone said this after a serious consideration, so it doesn't?

Many thanks.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Avangi — Sun, 27 Apr 2008 01:55:09 GMT

Hi Anon,

Probably the most famous of Asop's Fables is the one about the fox and the grapes. The fox sees some grapes high on a vine and thinks to himself that they must be delicious. He jumps many times trying to snatch some of them, but they're too high. He gives up, saying something like, "For all I know, they're sour anyway." He really doesn't know, and he pretends he doesn't care.

In my opinion, we could win the Lotto tonight. (Hopeful. No cynicism intended.) For all I know, we could win the Lotto tonight. (Don't know; don't really care. There's a flavor of cynicism. Note that the inflection, or the tone of your voice when you say this, can make it more, or less cynical.)

In my opinion, you should join the Army. For all I know, you should join the Army. If you sincerely wish to advise your friend to join the Army, and you think it's in his best interest, which would you choose?

- A.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Grammar Geek — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 21:34:11 GMT

As I understand the intended meanin, the other expressions ("in my opinoin," etc.) do NOT make you think something sarcastic, etc., will follow the same way "As far as I'm concerened" makes you think that.

They can all go to hell, as far as I'm concerned is obviously not very nice. You would probably not say They can all go to hell, in my opnion.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Anonymous — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:49:25 GMT

Thank you GG for joining us for the thread. I don't know the meaning of "The others may also, but they don't put up a red flag." I think 'the others' Avangi referred to may be the expressions like 'in my opinion'. What does 'in my opinion' doesn't put up a red flag' mean here?

Thanks a lot.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Grammar Geek — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:07:32 GMT

I'm not Avangi, but I can respond I think.

He has given you VERY good guidance on these.

"the brains God gave a flea" - how big is a flea? Quite small, right? So how much "brains" (i.e., intelligence") can a flea have? If you say someone doesn't have the brains God gave a flea, you are saying she is not very bright.

"a red flag" - something that is a warning, that makes you suspicious about something.

AIDS is a rather seious thing. I would require a very special context to make such a dismissive statement about somethign so serious.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Anonymous — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 18:50:15 GMT

Hi Avangi,

Thank you very much for your input.

What do 'God gave a flea' and 'put up a red flag' mean in your post?

'For all I know she's got aids.'
Does this mean 'It is possible that she have got aids, but I don't care'?

'For all I know you should join the army.'
What does this mean? I still dont get it!

Thanks a lot.

Re: as far as one's concerned

New2grammar — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 11:19:39 GMT

Bravo, Avangi. Very good explanation! I totally understand but it takes practice to master them.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Avangi — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 21:33:55 GMT

Hi Anon,

I would say that for all I know and as far as I'm concerned are in a class apart from all the others we've mentioned.

(1) They MAY be used to introduce (are in fact the preferred vehicles for introducing) insulting, sarcastic, slanderous, or libelous remarks. The others may also, but they don't put up a red flag. (In my opinion she doesn't have the brains God gave a flea.)

(2) While "in my opinion" is totally and completely neutral (could be strong or weak, absolutely certain or just a suspicion, praising or condemning), each of the two above carries its own unique implication, for better or for worse. For all I know = don't know, don't care. I'm thinking of a great old ballad from the 30's or 40's: [second half] For all we know, this may only be a dream. We come and go like the ripples on a stream. So love me tonight, tomorrow was made for some; tomorrow may never come, For All We Know. That's about as positive as it gets. Compare that with a negative use, "For all I know she's got aids." Anyway, I wouldn't use it to urge someone to take your advice to do some very important thing which may impact his entire life, and which anyone would agree is a wonderful thing to do. "For all I know you should join the army." Really? Get it? It's like, "For all I care - - - ." As far as I'm concerned also has a dismissive flavor, but it stresses the fact that your own involvement in the issue may be limited, and/or others may have a completely different view, and you're speaking only for yourself. (Of course, "in my opinion" may be used that way also.)

I'd say the principal difference between the two is the difference between limited involvement and limited knowledge. The principal similarity is the dismissiveness.

Best wishes, - A.

Re: as far as one's concerned

Anonymous — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 17:18:26 GMT

Hi Avangi

Thank you very much for your explanation and helpful advice. Is it safe to use 'as far as I'm concerned' or 'for all I know' instead of 'in my opinion', which is used in a perfectly serious and innocent speculation way (no sarcasm)?

E.g.
"In my opinion, that's very sound advice; you should take it."

"As far as I am concerned, that's very sound advice; you should take it."

"For all I know, that's very sound advice; you should take it."

Do 'as far as I'm concerned' and 'for all I know' mean the same?

I can't figure out their difference.

Thank you very much for your great help.