ESL General English Grammar Questions

Re: didn't come

Newguest — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 21:45:05 GMT

Thank you for all the answers guys!

Re: didn't come

CalifJim — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 21:39:15 GMT

Newguest
So both conditionals would be OK, the only difference is that first conditional indicates that something will most probably happen and the second that it is just a hypothesis, speculation?

Yes. That's the basic idea.

Re: didn't come

Newguest — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 21:16:40 GMT

CalifJim
Newguest
Isn't it better to use the first conditional?
Not necessarily, but the first conditional is also a possibility. The second conditional simply indicates that we're thinking about the situation in a hypothetical way -- musing about a possibility in a sort of theoretical way -- a sort of "What if?" way.

CJ

I see. So both conditionals would be OK, the only difference is that first conditional indicates that something will most probably happen and the second that it is just a hypothesis, speculation?

Re: didn't come

CalifJim — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 21:11:01 GMT

Newguest
Isn't it better to use the first conditional?

Not necessarily, but the first conditional is also a possibility. The second conditional simply indicates that we're thinking about the situation in a hypothetical way -- musing about a possibility in a sort of theoretical way -- a sort of "What if?" way.

Re: didn't come

Planet Hopper — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 21:05:33 GMT

In second conditionals the past simple is hypothetical, not really time-bound...in some usage grammar books it's called 'unreal past'

Hypothesis or conditionality is not considered time-bound, at least regarding this case. Only first conditionals take the if-clause in present and the second clause in future. The rest of conditional sentences and tenses are bound by aspect (perfection) and unreal reference.

So first part refers to hypothesis, no time...the second tense is subordinated to the first one, it entails future only to the first tense.

The whole patttern looks at the future, as a sequence.

Cheers :)

Re: didn't come

Newguest — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 20:58:50 GMT

CalifJim
It's just a normal "Second Conditional".

If he came with us (tomorrow), we would be happy.

If he didn't come with us (tomorrow), we would be disappointed.

We would be delighted if you came with us on our trip next month.

The children's hearts would break if the teacher cancelled the outing to the zoo next week.

The children would be very sad if the teacher didn't fulfill her promise of a special treat tomorrow.

CJ

Isn't it better to use the first conditional?

We will be happy if he comes with us

We will be disappointed if he doesn't come with us

We will be delighted if you come with us on..

The children's hearts will break if the teacher cancells..

Thanks

Re: didn't come

CalifJim — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 20:47:39 GMT

It's just a normal "Second Conditional".

If he came with us (tomorrow), we would be happy.

If he didn't come with us (tomorrow), we would be disappointed.

We would be delighted if you came with us on our trip next month.

The children's hearts would break if the teacher cancelled the outing to the zoo next week.

The children would be very sad if the teacher didn't fulfill her promise of a special treat tomorrow.

Re: didn't come

Newguest — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 18:59:28 GMT

Look at the very last example on this page:

http://www.englishpage.com/conditional/mixedconditional.html

According to this: If Seb DIDN'T COME with us.. refers to the future and it is a bit strange to me, though maybe it shouldn't.

Re: didn't come

Fandorin — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 17:50:21 GMT

It's called the Second Conditional. It refers to the present or to the future and expresses unreal situation.

If Tom didn't come with us to the beach, everyone would be very disappointed. It means that: He doesn't come to the beach.

didn't come

Newguest — Wed, 15 Oct 2008 17:37:30 GMT

If Tom didn't come with us to the beach, everyone would be very disappointed.

--- does the first part of the sentence refers to the future and the second one to the present? I'm not sure I understand it.