http://www.englishforums.com/English/EslGeneralEnglishGrammar-Questions/Forum12.htmAsk your questions on grammar and get your sentence checked. We answer lots of different types of general English grammar questions here. <font color=red>DO NOT post paragraphs and compositions here. Post them in our <a href="http://www.englishforums.com/English/EssayReportCompositionWriting/Forum9.htm"><b>Essay, Report and Composition Writing Forum</b></a>.</font>enXMOD (Build: 3715.30106)http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#778373Sat, 13 Jun 2009 08:41:45 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:778373Goodman0http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#778373http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-778373.xmlYou know what Avangi? You have just coined a new term &quot;adapted native&quot;! I like that!http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#778143Sat, 13 Jun 2009 00:09:22 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:778143northwind1http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#778143http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-778143.xmlWOOW!! How nice! I feel like I&#39;ve met my good friends in my hometown after a long journey or a hard space travel. Gotcha! Gotcha! And gotcha! Thanks!!http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#778135Sat, 13 Jun 2009 00:07:42 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:778135Avangi2http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#778135http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-778135.xmland the truth is not overly stretched, May we consider you native by adoption? - A.http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#777976Fri, 12 Jun 2009 22:08:34 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777976Goodman3http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#777976http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777976.xmlBut the fact is that native speakers are so familiar with this expression (eg., Goodman) that we say &quot;you can&#39;t have your cake and eat it,&quot; and we never worry about being misunderstood. Avangi, Just so your nice comment is not misrepresnted, and the truth is not overly stretched, I can only be qualified as &quot;half-native&quot; at best if such a thing exists. Big Smile&quot; src=&quot;http://www.englishforums.com/emoticons/emotion-2.gif&quot; mce_src=&quot;/emoticons/emotion-2.gif&quot;&gt;.http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#777898Fri, 12 Jun 2009 20:49:15 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777898Avangi4http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#777898http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777898.xmlSorry, but I&#39;m so serious. I appreciate that. I neglected to explain that the time factor is not part of the structure of the expressions. It&#39;s part of the collocations. When I said &quot;people understand it to mean &#39;at the same time,&#39; &quot; that was misleading. Sorry. You were correct in your original post to assume that the two statements are independent, without prior context. But to a native speaker, the prior context (that we mean at the same time, or in the same scenario) is as well-known as an old joke. When the details of the story are added to the mix, it really is about the same as an old joke. Mary can make pizza and lasagna. There&#39;s nothing here to suggest that we mean &quot;at the same...http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#777784Fri, 12 Jun 2009 18:46:26 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777784Goodman5http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/2/jzbjw/Post.htm#777784http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777784.xmlHi Norwolf, I see you are really entangled with the explanations of the idiom which we have spent much time on. When someone make a reference about another person, &quot;so and so can&#39;t walk and chew gum the same time&quot;, he is basically intending to say &quot;he is not very bright, or well coordinated&quot;. On the other hand, what you have on the list can not be covered with a simple explanation because each one by itself has a slightly different meaning, depending on the full context. I always place a high importance on context because without it, words are just words. What do the following senences mean? These are not the correct forms of the expression. Though, I still would make a few comments on...http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777734Fri, 12 Jun 2009 17:50:36 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777734AlpheccaStars6http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777734http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777734.xmlIt is, after all, physically impossible to ride a bike and drive a car at the same time. Unless it is one of those Human powered taxis!http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777679Fri, 12 Jun 2009 16:57:00 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777679RayH7http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777679http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777679.xmlTom can walk and chew gum at the same time. I think you&#39;re getting lost in the details. The point of this particular saying is that someone can successfully do more than one thing at a time. Given that understanding it should be obvious that the &quot;bike/car&quot; example is irrelevant. It is, after all, physically impossible to ride a bike and drive a car at the same time.http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777678Fri, 12 Jun 2009 16:56:10 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777678Grammar Geek8http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777678http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777678.xmlWe need to use another example besides the &quot;walk and chew gum&quot; one because that&#39;s an idiom almost always used with a negative feel (can&#39;t walk and chew gum at the same time, can barely walk and chew gum) and the clear implication is that the person is not very skilled at much. If you say &quot;Jane has many talents. She can bake a delicious pie and build a treehouse. She can change a flat tire and sew an evening gown&quot; there is NO implication that she does those things at the same time. In fact, to imply that she does these things at the same time is ridiculous. If you say &quot;Tom can ride a bike and drive a car&quot; there is no implication he does both at the same time. Oddly, saying...http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777663Fri, 12 Jun 2009 16:41:23 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777663northwind9http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777663http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777663.xmlWow, wow, wow! I have been in a mess. But now I&#39;m OK. Gotcha!! Thanks!! But, ...can I ask one more? What do the following senences mean? Tom can walk and chew gum. Tom can ride on a bike and drive a car. Do they mean the same as the followings? Tom can walk and chew gum at the same time. Tom can ride on a bike and drive a car at the same time. Sorry, but I&#39;m so serious.http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777423Fri, 12 Jun 2009 13:07:58 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777423Avangi10http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777423http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777423.xmlSince the horse is dead, you&#39;re welcome to join the party.http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777108Fri, 12 Jun 2009 07:03:02 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777108Goodman11http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777108http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777108.xmlOh dear! How much more can be beat this dead horse? MM already concluded this question with 2 examples which most native would agree using. In a nut shall, it means one can&#39;t have it both ways, like ordering your breakfast eggs over-easy scrambled. Well, you know the picture. If there is still confusion with this proverb. This should clear it up: http://www.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/eatcake.html YOU CAN’T EAT YOUR CAKE AND HAVE IT TOO The most popular form of this saying—“You can’t have your cake and eat it too”— confuses many people because they mistakenly suppose the word “have” means “eat,” as in “Have a piece of cake for dessert.” A more logical version of this saying is “You can’t eat your...http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777022Fri, 12 Jun 2009 06:13:43 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777022Avangi12http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777022http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777022.xmlAre the meanings of the following sentences the same? No. You can&#39;t have your cake and eat it. You can&#39;t have your cake and you can&#39;t eat it. You can&#39;t have your cake and eat it(,) too. You can&#39;t have your cake and you can&#39;t eat it(,) too. The first and third mean that you can&#39;t do both. The second and fourth mean that you can&#39;t do either. In the following description, I put the meanings inside the quatation marks. I think the first and the second sentences have the same two meanings, meaning 1 and meaning2. Meaning 1. &quot;You can&#39;t have your cake. You can&#39;t eat it.&quot; You can&#39;t have your cake. has nothing to do with You can&#39;t eat it. So the firt...http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777001Fri, 12 Jun 2009 05:58:27 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:777001Mister Micawber13http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htm#777001http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-777001.xmlOnly these are acceptable: You can't have your cake and eat it. You can't have your cake and eat it, too . The other two are grammatically correct but carry no useful meaning-- obviously, if you don't have something, you can do nothing with it.http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htmFri, 12 Jun 2009 01:44:59 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:776704northwind14http://www.englishforums.com/English/YouCantCake/jzbjw/post.htmhttp://www.englishforums.com/English/comments12-776704.xmlI posted the following question a few days ago but I couldn&#39;t have a reply. But it&#39;s still on my mind. So please let me ask the same question one more time. Are the meanings of the following sentences the same? You can&#39;t have your cake and eat it. You can&#39;t have your cake and you can&#39;t eat it. You can&#39;t have your cake and eat it(,) too. You can&#39;t have your cake and you can&#39;t eat it(,) too. In the following description, I put the meanings inside the quatation marks. I think the first and the second sentences have the same two meanings, meaning 1 and meaning2. Meaning 1. &quot;You can&#39;t have your cake. You can&#39;t eat it.&quot; You can&#39;t have your cake. has...