http://www.englishforums.com/English/LegalEnglish/Forum34.htmInternational law and specific national laws can be discussed here.enXMOD (Build: 3607.32596)http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/3/bhbgv/Post.htm#803404Thu, 02 Jul 2009 19:13:48 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:803404Anonymous0http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/3/bhbgv/Post.htm#803404http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-803404.xml>>"In the second place, 'for' is a preposition and can only be followed by a noun or >>pronoun." Then what about "for richer or for poorer"?http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/3/bhbgv/Post.htm#683894Sat, 07 Mar 2009 03:13:00 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:683894Anonymous1http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/3/bhbgv/Post.htm#683894http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-683894.xmlI agree. This "for free" is a slang term that drives me up a wall. I work for a daily newspaper and asked the writing coach about it. He echoed what Grammar Granny wrote above.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#467464Fri, 22 May 2009 01:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:467464Alienvoord2http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#467464http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-467464.xmlGrammar Granny wrote: I was told by a professional editor that 'for free' was incorrect, no matter how much it is in common use. They must have a strange definition of "incorrect". In the first place it is redundant. Redundancy needs some better PR. These are all redundant: three different ways start over again These five passages have not been picked out because they are especially bad... I number them so that I can refer back to them - Orwell, Politics and the English Language There are places where we cannot substitute "free" for "for free". Well we can, but it gives a different meaning: 1a It seemed best to find a way to live for free. 1b It seemed best to find a way to live free 2a The hat they throw in extra for...http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#465934Thu, 22 Jan 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:465934Grammar Geek3http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#465934http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-465934.xmlInteresting. I would have said one the first things you learn in a good communications course is the importance of understanding your audience and making sure you select the words and medium most likely to make your message understood. I would have thought they'd save things like that for the "pedantic editing" section of the course and not put that up front.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#465930Sun, 22 Mar 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:465930Anonymous4http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#465930http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-465930.xmlIt's free, not for free it's one of the first things you learn in a (good) communications course.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#459393Fri, 22 May 2009 01:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:459393Hummingbird5http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#459393http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-459393.xmlI think since native speakers normally say it, one can speak it but not use it in writing.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#457833Sun, 22 Feb 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:457833Lawyee6http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#457833http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-457833.xmlSince this is a legal section of the Forum, it should be noted that none of the aforementioned should be used in legal texts. They are not proper and accurate enough (although "free" is gramatically correct). Try to use "without consideration" or "free of charge" instead. By the way, what is free of charge... except of diseases maybe?http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#457706Fri, 22 May 2009 01:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:457706Anonymous7http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#457706http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-457706.xmlThree cheers for Grammar Granny. Free is correct. For free is POOR GRAMMAR and shouldn't be used. Grammar needs to be brought back into elementary schools. The problem is that there are probably not enough teachers who understand the english language.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#235427Sun, 22 Feb 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:235427Clive8http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#235427http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-235427.xmlHi guys, I think that people who say 'He got it for free' are mistakenly influenced by the structure 'He got it for five dollars'. Best wishes, Clivehttp://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#235327Thu, 22 Jan 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:235327Anonymous9http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#235327http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-235327.xmlI agree. You cannot get something for a state of being. It's either free or not. Same with free gift. All gifts are free or they're not gifts, right?http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#148815Sun, 22 Mar 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:148815Citox10http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/2/bhbgv/Post.htm#148815http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-148815.xmlI think A is right.by the way ,a question for julielai,are you chinese? if you are,please contact me i'm a boy in beijinghttp://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#130170Sun, 22 Mar 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:130170Grammar Granny11http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#130170http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-130170.xmlI was told by a professional editor that 'for free' was incorrect, no matter how much it is in common use. In the first place it is redundant. Either something is free or it costs something. Saying it is for free means it doesn't, doesn't cost anything. In the second place, 'for' is a preposition and can only be followed by a noun or pronoun. 'Free' can be either an adjective or a verb, but not a noun or pronoun. Any time an ad or a website uses this phrase, I doubt its validity.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#127842Wed, 22 Apr 2009 01:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:127842Forbes12http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#127842http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-127842.xmlDavid wrote: Both are used. Can't disagree with you there. The point is perhaps which is felt to be more appropriate for formal use at the present time. I just "felt" that "free" was better and the dictionary I happen to own agrees with me by saying that "for free" is non-standard. As with many words and phrases the non-standard one may become standard and eventually replace or stand alongside the originally preferred one. Since this is the legal forum I would venture to suggest that many lawyers' preferences would be for the more conservative form.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#127762Thu, 22 Jan 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:127762David13http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#127762http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-127762.xmlBoth are used.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#127700Fri, 22 May 2009 01:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:127700Forbes14http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#127700http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-127700.xmlTimKowal wrote: However, here is a problem with that type of analysis I agree entirely that that type of analysis does not work when you look at something seriously, but it does help to make a point sometimes.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#127071Sun, 22 Mar 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:127071TimKowal15http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#127071http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-127071.xmlI say that simply "free" is more correct, but not absolutely correct. I liked the analysis that said that "for free" translates into "for for free." However, here is a problem with that type of analysis: Another dictionary definition says "free" means "without charge." American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition. Analyzing the usage of free is not as simple as plugging in the dictionary defintion, because if we did so, then we could not say "free of charge," since this would become "free of charge without charge." This is nonsense, of course, so we have to abandon this analysis. I prefer to think of "free" as "without constraint." We can talk about being free of social constraints, free of...http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#122383Fri, 22 May 2009 01:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:122383Forbes16http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#122383http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-122383.xmlI feel the opposite. In this context "free" means "for nothing" and so "for free" is equivalent to "for for free". I checked in my dictionary ( Collins ) which indicated that "for free" is non-standard.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#118658Sun, 22 Feb 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:118658Robert B. Mercer17http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#118658http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-118658.xmlI agree with JulieLai, I believe that "you can get it free" is a slang shorting for the correct "you can get it for free"...http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#118456Wed, 22 Apr 2009 01:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:118456julielai18http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htm#118456http://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-118456.xmlI normally say A.http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htmThu, 22 Jan 2009 02:02:25 GMT946f00bb-57d3-4b7b-a9a2-059b5341af52:118307Anonymous19http://www.englishforums.com/English/FreeVsForFree/bhbgv/post.htmhttp://www.englishforums.com/English/comments34-118307.xmlWhich is proper English? A) You can get it for free . or B) You can get it free .