Search results for 'tag:American English tag:Speak english' matching tags 'American English' and 'Speak english'

Re: Difference between European English and US English.

Bokeh — Tue, 03 Jul 2007 20:14:07 GMT

Nona The Brit wrote:
slum prudery? Interesting turn of phrase.

It's from "My Fair Lady".

Nona The Brit wrote:
I think it is pretty true that a lot of British people don't consider us as part of Europe in quite the same way as other Europeans. Politically, yes.

I think the British people scared to embrace being Europeans are those who believe the imperialistic conservative nonsense that to be British is to be better.

Nona The Brit wrote:
But geographically, no.

Geographically, yes! The UK and Eire sit on the European continental shelf with a sea depth of less than 50 metres right the way around.

Nona The Brit wrote:
No other European countries have English as their native mother-tongue language.

That's true but it is also true that it's not the mother tongue of several million British subjects. (According to Wikipedia 70% of the UK population speak English monolingually.)

Nona The Brit wrote:
I think there are European countries which teach American English rather than the British version so how does that factor in?

Try doing a search on the web for British schools in Europe compared to American ones. Look at translation agencies and see how their FAQs specifically point out that they do British English. Also if you look at style guides for documents translated for the European Union you would see they state spellings and grammar should be British. Lastly it doesn't make sense that mainland Europe should learn US English in place of British English. Trade between the UK and its EU partners far exceeds any trade between the US and mainland Europe.

Re: USA or UK

Charlotte_T — Mon, 28 May 2007 14:14:19 GMT

Thethenothere123 wrote:
Grammar Geek wrote:
I haven't read through all the pages on this topic, but has anyone commented on how NON-homogeneous UK and US English is? It's not like there's one "British English" or one "American English" unless you're been to broadcasting school. Someone from Yorkshire and someone from Cornwall have about as much in common as either does to someone from Alabama or Maine.

That's a good point. I honestly can't remember whether or not anyone has made it. However, I did try to make the point that for the vast majority of the people that speak English, the only real difference is the accent and certain prefernces in word usage (which are almost always understood perfectly well by everyone). In addition to that, there are some extremely minor differences in grammar/punctuation conventions between AmE and BrE, and that's it.

I agree there're always differences between British English spoken by two people from different places, eg. London and Oxford. But why can we differentiate between BrE and AmE? That's because, generally, there're still a lot of similarities between accents of Yorkshire and Cornwall, although we can't deny there're actually not the same. I think we're all talking about this issue generally, don't we? We sort out the accents into 2 main groups: AmE and BrE. Then under BrE group there're a lot of 'sub-groups'. It's hard to discuss and study in details about accents of Yorkshire and Cornwall because even people living in the same place could have slightly different accents.

P/S I mean no harm and I'm just trying to tell my opinions.

Re: What makes English so difficult to learn?

Marvin A. — Sat, 31 Mar 2007 15:55:37 GMT

and an ignorant American would look at British and pronounce practise (Br. spelling) like practize....

Highly unlikely.

Americans on the other hand, have been butchering it for centuries and should not be consulted when learning this language. It is, after all, English and not American.

Rubbish. North American English is in many ways much closer to Elizabethan English than British English, Australian English and New Zealand English.

Anonymous Australian.

Well, we could say that Australian English speakers are "butchering the language": for one thing, most of you have forgotten how to prononounce your r's; your vowels are quite different earlier forms of English, and your vocabulary has shifted quite a bit.

It is, after all, English and not American.

Well, it's not Australian either.

so it is logical that the more words one knows, the more thoughts one can have.

How is that logical? Other languages can also be quite expressive. Just because English "has" over a million words, you have to realize that many are simply restricted to medicine; others are not in common use and would be quite incomprehensible to most people. Just by possessing a copious amount of words (many of these so called "English words" are hardly native words, and are not understood by many people), doesn't mean that English is more expressive than other languages in all respects.

It (the spelling) was fixed 400 years ago

Yes, for the most part. But what I don't understand, is if someone wants to simply be able to speak English (and doesn't care about reading and writing), why don't they simply use a phonetic alphabet when learning English.

though I'm convinced once upon a time it really was pronounced "kuh-ni-git"

Actually in Old and Middle English, the "k" was pronounced (but there was no "uh" after it), and the "g" was pronounced like in the word "Loch" if you put on a Scottish accent.

Or meaby something from German: einhundertfunfundzwazig (125) - this is correct spelling, there shouldn't be any spaces!!!

Well, it's easy enough to break down, and is hardly harder than onehundredtwentyfive.

You say its easy, and yet you write 'learned' instead of 'learnt' - a classic example.

"learned" and "learnt" tend to be pretty well interchangeable.

Re: Cool Breeze thanks the Englishforums team

Cool Breeze — Thu, 15 Mar 2007 10:22:58 GMT

Hi Kooyeen

There is nothing to forgive! I am certainly not in the least offended by your post. In fact, I enjoyed reading it tremendously! I even agree with you to some extent on some of the points you made.

I am the first person to admit that my knowledge of English isn't as good as that of a native speaker. I know that my knowledge of my mother tongue, Finnish, is far better than my English. I am conscious of my shortcomings. May I just point out that all speakers of all living languages are learners. I learn new Finnish words all the time, and native speakers of English learn new words as these words make their way into the language. The learning process is incessant owing to the fact that languages evolve.

You say that every nonnative speaker wants to write, speak and sound like a native speaker. That is not true. I don't. I have mentioned this earlier in my posts in other threads. I have always thought it paradoxical that even though English has an extremely large vocabulary, native speakers are in many situations limited to a few fixed phrases that they 'must' use to sound natural. I don't necessarily want to sound 'natural'. That's why I don't always conform to generally accepted phrases and idioms.

Nor do all others. In the Far East, for example, an English dictionary has been published which contains such words as farang and actsy. They say they have colonised the English language. English is the lingua franca these days, and whether native speakers like it or not, it will transform in the various localities and connexions where it is used.

Another factor is what I might call national pride -- for lack of a better word. I don't want to sound British, American, Canadian, Australian or anything else when I speak English. I am a Finn and I want to sound Finnish. I know my accent is close to American English and I have been taken for an American on a number of occasions. Finland is an unknown country and I prefer it that people know where I am from when I travel. I am often in for better treatment that way. Finland never colonised anything and has not been involved in any major international wars or skirmishes recently, which means it has few foes. I never have to hear 'Finn, go home' slogans on my travels. A couple of years ago the US embassy in Latvia or Lithuania issued a warning to US citizens travelling in the Baltic countries asking them to keep a low profile and to avoid conversation in a loud voice. We all know why.

You are partly right as to what I consider my 'main reference point' regarding correct usage. It is usually native speakers when the use of a word or an expression is in question. When grammar is involved, we must bear in mind the fact that many authoritative grammar books were written by nonnative speakers such as Otto Jespersen and R.W. Zandvoort. Of course that does not mean that grammar books by natives are no good.

Please feel free to post a reply, Kooyeen. I look forward to it! As a matter of fact, I'm counting on getting one!

Cheers
CB
PS: I hope no one minds my spelling of nonnative. I have not been able to find a hyphenated non-native in any dictionary.

Re: Who's learning Indian English?

milky — Sun, 21 Jan 2007 10:09:14 GMT

When were native speakers exported to the US? The US became the US at what date?

Was France ruled by Britain for a few hundred years?

<Now, we could certainly call this a "dialect", and even a "standardized dialect" of English-->

As is Standard American English.

May Americans would not eveb know that Denmark is a country. So, time to educate yourselves?

How many people would that be?

<Remember, that we have a different mentality over here, since we are not often exposed to people with a strong accent. >

Not even Spanish speakers? I think what is really happening here is that you and your mates don't have much contact with "foreigners" who live in your country.

I've been teaching EFL for 26 years all over the globe. Most of the studtent complaints I get about understandability are related to the way white Americans speak.

Re: Who's learning Indian English?

Marvin A. — Sat, 20 Jan 2007 16:52:16 GMT

Sorry to contradict you, but that is exactly what is happening in the USA today. Speakers of other Standard variants and indeed taking classes in using Standard American English. The question is, why don't Standard American English speakers, want to do the same when they plan to have long-term contact with certain speakers of other standard dialects?

I think the difference, is that English originated in England, and some of the native speakers were exported to the US, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. They spoke the original dialects, which slowly went their separate ways over the years. This is a totally difference case, then when non-native speakers learn English. The situation in India is about the same as that in France. The French learn English at school, and/or from their parents. Their parents are *not* native speakers of English. Now, we could certainly call this a "dialect", and even a "standardized dialect" of English--because they would all make the same mistakes, etc., and have very similar pronunciation and grammar. Even if they learned it as a second or third generation person--e.g. their grandparents passed down their knowledge of English to their children, who then passed it on to their children. Ok, this is all well and good, but if they decided to go to an English speaking country, they would not be regarded as being native speakers of English (whether or not they technically were). I have a feeling that when it comes to Indian-English, it is more common to hear it Britain than it is in North America (excluding our larger cities). I know that over there, there are many Indians--so it is more likely that they would consider it to be a proper dialect of English and grant it recognition as a valid form of English. Over here, I'd say that the majority of people don't even know that many people speak English in India, and even if they did, it would be regarded rather the same as how French people, or how Koreans speak English. To add to the problems, since it is not a form of English that we are used to, from what I've heard, it is considered to be one of the *most* difficult accent on English to understand--most people I've talked to have rated it far below say a strong Chinese, or Vietnamese accent in comprehension. Remember, that we have a different mentality over here, since we are not often exposed to people with a strong accent. That is why they would have to learn a recognized dialect of English. Ironically enough, though, if they learned a nearly perfect British accent of English, they would be more likely to be considered to be native speakers of English on this side of the pond, than if they learned a near perfect North American dialect.

Re: Can a L2-learner become a native speaker?

Marvin A. — Mon, 01 Jan 2007 21:25:00 GMT

Englishuser wrote:
What do you mean, Marvin?

Englishuser

Well, in some ways, learning a different variety of English could be a good idea. If the lady I had met had learned English with a North American accent, I would most likely have realized that she was not a native speaker. But because she had learned English with a British accent, I actually thought that she was a native speaker. Thus, in order to receive "native speaker status" (and by this I mean that people assume she is a native speaker of English.), she could get away with speaking less than perfect British English, whereas she would have to speak with an absolutely *perfect* North American English accent in order to be thought to be a native speaker here. Since learning a fairly good British accent is *much* easier than learning an absolutely flawless North American accent, foreigners from countries that are known to be able to learn to speak English with a fairly good accent, for example, Denmark and the Netherlands, might consider opting to learn the opposite accent from the country they are planning to visit. I have heard many non-native speakers who have learned English when they were older, who have had to my ears a native-sounding British accent, but very few who have had a native-sounding North American accent--there are always certain things that give it away.

I wonder if it's the same on the other side of the pond? Do you more often mistake foreigners who have a North American accent for native speakers, than foreigners who have an accent that is a closely approximated, but not quite British accent?

Re: British Accents

Ruttonjee — Sun, 17 Dec 2006 03:43:43 GMT

Hi there,

I am a non-native English learner. I often visit Randall's ESL Listening Cyber Lab http://www.esl-lab.com/ to practise listening and speaking skills. I find this website very useful in learning to new American English expressions. Can you suggest any similar websites but in British English because I want to learn new expressions used in Britain. By the way, are the expressions in the above websites also used in Britain? If yes, it is strange if I use them in conversation with British accents since I speak English with British accents instead of American accents.

simon

Re: do/play sports (AmE)

Kooyeen — Fri, 21 Jul 2006 12:12:16 GMT

Thank you very much Clive,

Clive wrote:

But you won't go to jail if you say this. Don't think that we always speak English in a precise way, please.

I'd probably just answer 'I swim twice a week, and I cycle'.

Usually, the questioner just wants to know if you do or don't sit on the couch all week. They usually don't much care how you answer such a question.

that's what I wanted you to say! Especially "Don't think that we always speak English in a precise way", but unfortunely that's what confuses learners most.

GrammarGeek, I forgot to tell you I' learning American English! Anyway I knew you are American. So it's all right. And thanks a lot to you too.

Re: USA or UK

Thethenothere123 — Thu, 15 Jun 2006 06:10:13 GMT

Grammar Geek wrote:
I haven't read through all the pages on this topic, but has anyone commented on how NON-homogeneous UK and US English is? It's not like there's one "British English" or one "American English" unless you're been to broadcasting school. Someone from Yorkshire and someone from Cornwall have about as much in common as either does to someone from Alabama or Maine.

That's a good point. I honestly can't remember whether or not anyone has made it. However, I did try to make the point that for the vast majority of the people that speak English, the only real difference is the accent and certain prefernces in word usage (which are almost always understood perfectly well by everyone). In addition to that, there are some extremely minor differences in grammar/punctuation conventions between AmE and BrE, and that's it.