Search results for 'tag:Dialects tag:Idioms' matching tags 'Dialects' and 'Idioms'

Re: TEFLese

Kooyeen — Fri, 12 Sep 2008 14:35:14 GMT

Anonymous
I agree, but I don't think that sentences get any more authentic as one progresses through the learning levels. Even at advanced level, there's lots of TEFLese English going on in classrooms world over. TEFLese is a dialect. It is a product.

I know, and that's why I believe once a learner is enough "advanced" they don't need any more courses, grammars, or specific teachers. That's when they need more advanced vocabulary and idioms, which they can pick up by practicing the way they like the most. Oh, let's not forget the dictionaries... You can't throw those away, they are absolutely vital (without them, I would write worse than so, and I wouldn't be learning new vocabulary so fast).

Re: If I'm used only to Standard English, might I have trouble understanding dialects?

Mr Wordy — Thu, 29 May 2008 14:26:35 GMT

There are some differences in vocabulary and idiom across the British Isles, and you might encounter some regional words and expressions that you're not familiar with. But the core vocabulary and grammar are not hugely different, and you might find that a bigger problem is pronunciation. If you're only familiar with the sort of English spoken by middle class people from the south of England, and you go into a pub in a rough part of Glasgow, say, then you might not even realise that the people there are speaking English at all.

The native speakers I (as a native speaker myself) have most difficulty with are young urban working class people. In this case, vocabulary (lots of "yoof slang" I've never heard of) and pronunciation both cause problems. I might overhear, say, a group of youths chatting in a London suburb and only catch about 50% of it.

There's no need to try to speak regional dialects of British English yourself (unless you're particularly interested in doing so, of course). If you speak something approximating to "standard" British English then you should be able to make yourself understood anywhere in the British Isles.

Re: Native-speaker/native language

Tanit — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 13:03:57 GMT

Forbes

I remember listening to a radio programme about the varieties of forms of speech in Italy ... They simply change language like they change clothes without worrying about the status of their "home" speech.

There's some truth in that article. My parents, for instance, used to speak in Sardinian (not a dialect, but recognised as an endangered language by the UNESCO) when talking to each other or to their relatives, but they would only speak Italian with my brother and me. I grew up monolingual, and although I can understand Sardinian, I am unable to articulate a sentence that contains more than a few words!

Many people who speak both Italian and their dialect, although able to switch from the first to the second depending on the context, speak a form of Italian that I would classify as regional and sub-standard. I noticed that people from Southern Italy (I have little experience of Northern Italy) who speak also a dialect usually don't speak standard Italian, but a form of language deeply affected by their dialect. Accent is not an issue. I find some grammatical structures odd, as well as the choice of some verb modes, tenses and aspects (ex. past simple versus present perfect, indicative versus subjunctive), and have problems with some vocabulary (let alone idioms, of course). I am usually able to understand the general meaning, though.

Re: I need help with dialects.

Feebs11 — Tue, 03 Jul 2007 23:26:33 GMT

Write your dialogue as you might speak it, then post it, asking for comments from native Brits. There are idioms and speech patterns that are different.

Re: Canadians and their English

Anonymous — Thu, 19 Apr 2007 05:54:21 GMT

General Canadian English is extremely similar to General American English. However, there are a number of differences between the two dialects. Firstly, GCE (General Canadian English) exhibits a linguistic phenomenon called Canadian Raising. Basically, the diphthong âaiâ--as in "by" or "lie"--is raised before voiceless consonants (t, k, p, s, f); by contrast, this diphthong is not raised before other consonants (v, z, d, b, l, m, n, r, etc). Thus, by using Canadian Raising, the words in the following word pairs can be pronounced differently: ride and write, five and fife, and rise and rice.
The diphthong "au," as in "loud," is commonly raised before the consonants "t," "th," "ch," and "s." This diphthong is not raised before the consonants "d," "z," "n," and "j." As was pointed out, the word "about" sounds like "a boat"... well, to American ears, that is. In General American English, the diphthong "ai" is not raised before any consonant, nor is the diphthong "au." Yet, this raising has been occurring in various areas of the U.S., and it has spread quite far.

Another difference between these dialects is that, in GCE, the vowel "o" is always pronounced as "o" before the consonant "r." Therefore, âsorryâ is pronounced sor-ee, âborrowâ is pronounced bor-row, and âsorrow,â sor-row. In General American English, the vowel "o" is sometimes pronounced as the vowel "a"--as in "father"--before the consonant "r." In GAE (General American English), "sorry" is pronounced sar-ee, "borrow" is pronounced bar-row, and âsor-rowâ is pronounced sar-row. This, nevertheless, isn't very common in GAE; in fact, I canât think of any other word that is pronounced with the vowel âa,â other than sorrow, borrow, and sorry.

Many Canadians pronounce the word "marry" as "merry." In GAE, âmarryâ is pronounced with the vowel âae.â

In GCE, "pasta," "mazda," "lava," "drama," âYahooÂ®,â "taco," and other similar words are pronounced with the vowel "ae." In GAE, these words are pronounced with the vowel "a.â In GCE, on the other hand, these and few other foreign words are pronounced with the vowel "a": macho, Guatemala, Bach, and karate. Why is this so? I sure as heck don't know; it's an anomaly.

Of course, let's not forget Canadian lexicon. In Canada, "pop" is universally used as a term for a carbonated beverage. Even in the U.S., "pop" is used quite widely. It's largely used in the Midwest, Upper Midwest, and Northwest. As well, many Canadians refer to candy bars as "chocolate bars."
In GCE, the idioms "in hospital" and "to university" are used, in lieu of the American idioms "in the hospital" and "to the university," which includes a definite article. So, one may say, "I'm going to have my surgery in hospital," or "I'm going to attend university during the fall."

The last letter of the Canadian alphabet, "zed," is different from the last letter of the American alphabet, "zee."

Well, this is pretty much all I know about GCE.

Re: in the blue

MrPedantic — Sat, 24 Mar 2007 00:02:19 GMT

Milky wrote:

1. I bought the shirt in the blue.

2. I bought the shirt in the blue they are famous for.

#2 made sense to me on the first reading; it supplies its own context.

But I presumed that "in the blue" in #1 was an unfamiliar idiom from another dialect of English, till I read the following posts; after which it made sense.

Of course, it's now impossible to recreate that sense of unfamiliarity...

MrP

Which of the following three descriptions best describes dialect?

milky — Fri, 02 Feb 2007 10:49:47 GMT

Which of the following three descriptions best describes dialect?

1 'One of the subordinate forms of varieties of a language arising from local peculiarities of pronunciation and idiom.' [OED]

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2 'Variety of a language spoken by a group of people and having features of vocabulary, grammar, and/or pronunciation that distinguish it from other varieties of the same language. Dialects usually develop as a result of geographic, social, political, or economic barriers between groups of people who speak the same language. When dialects diverge to the point that they are mutually incomprehensible, they become languages in their own right' [Encyclopedia Britannica]

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3 'A dialect is a complete system of verbal communication (oral or signed but not necessarily written) with its own vocabulary and/or grammar.' [Wikipedia]

Re: simple meaning of dialect

Selecter — Sun, 07 Jan 2007 13:18:54 GMT

dialect
     n : the usage or vocabulary that is characteristic of a specific
         group of people; "the immigrants spoke an odd dialect of
         English"; "he has a strong German accent" [syn: idiom,
         accent

Re: How can you tell whether someone is a non-native speaker?

MrPedantic — Mon, 25 Sep 2006 23:09:12 GMT

Julielai wrote:

Just out of curiosity, Mr. P, how do you distinguish a native speaker who's learned a non-standard form of English from a decent non-native speaker? (e.g. How can you tell if a speaker born in India, Singapore or other Asian countries is native?)

Hello Julie

I'm not sure I always could â sometimes I'm not sure whether a poster is speaking erratic non-native English, or a US dialect, for instance (especially if the erraticism resides in the modal verbs!).

But on the whole, non-standard natives make different mistakes from non-native standards. NSNs may be unusual in grammar, but they're usually strong in idiom. And a very good NNS will often hyper-correct (in the use of the subjunctive, for instance, or the past perfect).

(I'm speaking very theoretically here, though â merely spouting impressions!)

MrP

Re: 'JUMPING OUT OF THEM Wall Street windows'

Marius Hancu — Sat, 24 Jun 2006 12:08:06 GMT

This isn't an idiom, just an expresion.

And btw: it's desperation

started JUMPING OUT OF THE Wall Street windows

THEM in this context is African-American speech/dialect, also used in South, I think; it seems that the author is an African-American.