Search results for 'tag:Expressions tag:Commas' matching tags 'Expressions' and 'Commas'

Re: optional comma placement?

Clive — Wed, 05 Nov 2008 05:51:35 GMT

Hi,
I think the following shows the case of optional comma placement. I think a comma (and some other punctuation marks??) can be used to allow some breathing space as readers read certain part of a text Yes and these seem to do that. As to the semicolon, would you say it is used since what followed after 'but' has an internal comma? No, I wouldn't.

He was begging for change; but he was shivering and his voice dying down, so that no one was able to hear what he was saying.

I'd say there are also other possible ways to punctuate this. eg
He was begging for change, but he was shivering and his voice dying down so that no one was able to hear what he was saying.

How about this? How can you decide if what follows a comma here is an essential element or not?

Is the underlined part treated as essential or unessential? If essential, why does it have a comma?

I tried to explain it in plain and simple English, without putting many unnecessary details. I see the underlined expression as adverbial, modifying the whole action described before the comma.

Clive

Re: 'and' or 'but' at the beginning of a sentence

kellyconnoro — Thu, 23 Oct 2008 18:39:56 GMT

The general grammatical rule as per the U.S.'s MLA (Modern Language Association) is that a comma and a coordinating conjunction ("fanboys" - for, and, nor, but, or, yet, so) connect two sentences together. The coordinating conjunction does just that, coordinates the meaning of the two either in comparison or in contrast to one another. For this reason, many English instructors "follow the rules" to teach the best possible way to convey meaning using symbols and usage familiar to the majority of readers. However, American modern and post-modern writers have been differentiating themselves along the historical trail by playing with language in all of its forms and structures. As per other examples in American English, creativity with the language often results in new standards forming that displace the old. Some see this as a corrosion of language, others as creative expression by a diverse linguistic culture

Re: A Few Questions

Grammar Geek — Fri, 17 Oct 2008 13:23:43 GMT

Hi Ditch,

Welcome to the forums.

Yes, in the future, it would be better to ask only one type of question in a thread. If they are related, then of course they can be in the same post.

Ditch

1. I understand that there is no rule against starting a sentence with a conjunction, but I am a little unclear on when it is best to do so.

This isn't exactly true. Informal writing accepts this, but formal writing does not.

Which is of the following is correct, and why?

A)     I wanted to see the movie, but I didnât have any money, but it was okay because my friend paid for my ticket. No, you can't string two "But..." clauses together.

B)     I wanted to see the movie, but I didnât have any money. But it was okay because my friend paid for my ticket. Okay in the most informal writing.

2. I sometimes see people use a comma and speech marks to express their own thoughts, but I have never seen any rule that suggests you should do so. This is a matter of style. Some people use the quotes. Some people use italics. Some make it more like reported speech.

Which of the following is correct?

A)     I thought, âWe should buy one of these.â OK

B)     I thought we should buy one of these. Would be better with a "that" to indicated the "reported speech" nature of the thought.

C) I though, we should buy one of these.

3. I have only ever heard the expression â[show] oneâs true colorsâ used in a negative sense. For example, âHe showed his true colors when he stole my wallet.â But can it also be used in a positive sense? For example, âHis acts of kindness revealed his true colors.â

Already answered, but in my opinion, if you say "his true colors" it means that you have developed an opinion of someone and this opinion turns out to be false as demonstrated by later acts. Usually it's negative, but in the right context, I suppose it could work.

4. Is it fair to say that if you use the idiom âafter allâ at the start of a sentence, it can only mean âbecause ultimatelyâ and not âdespite what happenedâ?

Yes, or "when you consider the thing in total." It does not draw a contrast to what came before, as you would expect if using "despite."

5. If âsupport with loveâ is written as a title, do you capitalize the preposition âwithâ? Another style question. Usually prepositions and articles are not capitalized. It's an odd title. (And of course the S and L would be.)

If I have made any grammar mistakes when writing my questions, please highlight those for me as well.

A Few Questions

Ditch — Fri, 17 Oct 2008 02:41:23 GMT

I understand that there is no rule against starting a sentence with a conjunction, but I am a little unclear on when it is best to do so.

Which is of the following is correct, and why?

A) I wanted to see the movie, but I didnât have any money, but it was okay because my friend paid for my ticket.

B) I wanted to see the movie, but I didnât have any money. But it was okay because my friend paid for my ticket.

I sometimes see people use a comma and speech marks to express their own thoughts, but I have never seen any rule that suggests you should do so.

Which of the following is correct?

A) I thought, âWe should buy one of these.â

B) I thought we should buy one of these.

I have only ever heard the expression â[show] oneâs true colorsâ used in a negative sense. For example, âHe showed his true colors when he stole my wallet.â But can it also be used in a positive sense? For example, âHis acts of kindness revealed his true colors.â

Is it fair to say that if you use the idiom âafter allâ at the start of a sentence, it can only mean âbecause ultimatelyâ and not âdespite what happenedâ?

5. If âsupport with loveâ is written as a title, do you capitalize the preposition âwithâ?

If I have made any grammar mistakes when writing my questions, please highlight those for me as well.

Re: expressions for a research project

Philip — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 22:54:49 GMT

Looks fine to me. Someone might suggest removing the comma after 'respondents' in the first sentence, but I think it's proper. It has to do with 'defining' or something or other I've never fully understood. I think CJ will be able to answer my doubts..he's excellent.

Re: comma usage and another

Avangi — Sun, 14 Sep 2008 00:00:13 GMT

2. I'd say "first light" is definitely not countable. That is, we don't have a "second light." I take "first light" as a fixed expression, or compound noun, or something like that.

I don't think "first" is used as a number here, but as a synonym for "beginning." (the beginning light of dawn) It's an interesting question, and probably may be argued.

If I say, "worked from the moment when dawn's light first shown," the problem goes away. I think that's what it really means here. "Moment" is countable. But still, when we say, "from the first moment," we don't expect to hear about the second moment.

Call the exterminator at the first sign of termites. "Signs" are clearly countable, but we don't usually talk about the "second sign" in a case like this. That is, "the first sign" is sort of a fixed expression.

1. The rules of commas are not strictly enforced. I use them only when they're mandated by a clear rule, or I truly feel they help make the sentence clear. I tend to use more commas than most people because I think clarity is more important than smooth flow.

I feel the same way about "that." In your two examples, I find the comma less offensive than the "that," and I think we might be okay without either.

- A.

Re: Filipinisms/Filipinoisms? Ring a bell?

Mister Micawber — Wed, 27 Aug 2008 00:07:37 GMT

.
I would consider this exercise damagingly prescriptive; most are neither uniquely Filipino nor wrong. However (and my comments refer to AmE/BrE):

1. Free subscription of... (Free subscription toâ¦) - prepo issue-- AmE/BrE uses the collocation subscribe to.
2. Can I speak withâ¦? (May I speak withâ¦) - To sound more polite/ask permission?-- Both OK. 'Can' is more casual but just as common.
3. Come again? (I'm sorry I didn't get quite get that / Excuse me? / I'm sorry would you please say that again?) - English trainers discourage agents to use this because they say that it could mean 'cum again')-- The English trainers are nuts. Come again is common and casual. Your examples in parentheses are overly formal for most situations.
4. It's for free! (It's free. / It's free of charge. / We're sending it to you for free.) - Filipinos have been used to saying 'It's for free'. How do I say that it should be avoided? What makes it wrong?-- Nothing makes it wrong; it's fine.
5. Hold your line/For awhileâ¦ (Would you mind if I put you on hold for a second? / Please hold) - hold your line is absurd. any comment? what about for awhile?-- I agree that 'Hold your line' is not natural in AmE/BrE. 'Please hold' or 'Could you hold, please' is the usual.
6. Open/ close the light/computer (Turn on/off the light/TV/computer) - how do I explain this? it sounds like opening/closing the tv for repair.- This seems to be a direct translation from Spanish? Tagalog? At least, it is the same error that Japanese make.
7. Do you mind waiting? Yes, I'll wait. (No, not at all. / No, I don't mind at all.) - YES is the issue. wrong response. any other feedback?-- 'Yes' is logically wrong but common when the tag ( e.g. 'I'll wait') is also present; speakers seldom have the opportunity to stop and think about the 'Do you mind?' form, and this includes native AmE/BrE speakers.
8. Anything? (Is there anything I can do for you? / How may I help you?) - fragmented, seems vague?-- Yes, it seems vague and fragmentary out of context.
9. I'll ask her an apology. (I'll apologize to her. / I should make an apology.) - this sounds illogical?-- Not a natural AmE/BrE formation.
10. We take lunch. (We eat lunch. / We have lunch (every Sunday).)-- 'Take' seems to be an occasional replacement in this context in many Englishes. It is not an egregious variation.
11. We accept repairs. (This shop repairs cars/cellphones, etc.)-- Seems fine to me.
12. We accept painting jobs. (This shop does painting jobs.)- Quite common.
13. Tuck out (Untuck)- Odd.
14. He was salvaged. (He was assassinated.)-- A new meaning for the word for me, and it is not in the dictionary. Perhaps some confusion with 'savaged'?
15. She delivered her baby yesterday. (She had her baby yesterday. / Dr. Smith delivered her baby.)-- This is fine. From the dictionary-- 'to give birth to: She delivered twins at 4 a.m. '
16. Xerox (Photocopy)-- Very common in AmE at least. Among my generation, 'to xerox' is perhaps more usual than 'to photocopy'.
17. Oppositor (Opposition member)-- A new word for me. Not a bad formation, but perhaps difficult to understand by foreigners.
18. Hand carry (Carry - on luggage)-- A new word, but reasonable.
19. It's traffic today. (Traffic is heavy.) -- It seems vague and fragmentary
20. Senatoriable (Senatorial candidate) -- Odder than #17
21. At around 2pm (At about 2pm) - around is Am? about is Brit?- Very common in AmE; it also appears with this meaning in the Cambridge dictionary.
22. I failed in Accent training. (I failed accent training.)-- A common expression, though I prefer your alternative.
23. We were under Mr. Johnson. (Mr. Johnson was our teacher.) - Filipinos are used to saying 'That student is under my class' so this filipinism has started.-- In context, 'We were under Mr. Johnson' sounds fine, while 'That student is under my class' does not.
24. My brother is taking up law. (My brother is taking law. / My brother is studying law.) -- 'Take up' is common, but means the overall intention, not just the matriculation.
25. Where are you studying? (Where do you go to school? / What school do you go to?)- 'Where are you studying' is fine.
26. Pass by my office before you go. (Drop by my office before you go.) - Brit/Am phrasal?-- Not AmE, at least. 'Stop by' or 'Drop by'.
27. We have one participant only. (We only have one participant.) - should they say 'only one participant'?-- The 'only' can go in several places; at the end is one of those places.
28. I talked to her already. (I already talked to her.) - I need help on adverb order. This confuses all Filipinos and me too. Where should adverbs be placed?- Adverbs are relatively variable in their placement. In this case, both are all OK. More interesting is that AmE uses simple past more consistently with 'yet' and 'already' than does BrE, which prefers the perfect aspect.
29. Will you be at the office at 7am? Actually. (Will you be at the office at 7am? Yes.)-- Not AmE/BrE
30. Actually, I like Jennifer Aniston. (I like Jennifer Aniston.) - Actually/basically has become Filipinos expressions.-- I wouldn't say that it is unique to Filipinos; many AmE speakers develop the habit in various contexts. Too much is too much, however.
31. As per Paul, all request forms should be signed by him. (As per Paul's instructions, all request forms should be signed by him.)-- This is common bizspeak throughout the English-speaking world.
32. Wanted: Sewer (Wanted: Tailor or seamstress)-- Yes, it is certainly open to misinterpretation! But 'seamstress' is sexist.
33. Take home (Take it home / To go. / For take out)-- 'Take home food' seems like a regional variant of 'take out food'.
34. I felt kind of tired. (I felt rather tired.)-- 'Kind of' is very common in informal AmE.
35. As to the projectâ¦ (About the projectâ¦)-- A common formality in most Englishes.
36. Thank you for that/this one. (Thank you for the information. / Thank you.) - I need to send this in a few minutes and I still couldn't think of an explanation. Phrasing sounds awkward to me. But besides getting straight to the point, why did 'for that/this one' make it wrong?-- 'One' is wrongly used; 'information' is uncountable.
37. I do love playing basketball/volleyball. (I love playing basketball/volleyball.) - this may sound right depending on the flow of the conversation, right? e.g. you don't love playing... No, I do...-- You are correct. This is called the emphatic 'do'.
38. Currently, I live in Quezon City right now. (Currently, I live in Quezon City. / I live in Quezon City.) - redundant - now and currently.- Yes, redundant.
39. Actually, I like Microsoft, Symantec and Adobe (I like Microsoft Symantec and Adobe)-- The comma is necessary if Microsoft and Symantec are different softwares.
40. As per Mon, all request forms should be signed by him. (As per Paul's instructions, all request forms should be signed by him.)-- This is the same as #31, and OK.
41. I do apologize (I apologize.)-- This is fine indeed. It is the same as #37, and is more polite than your bracketed alternative.
.

Suppose, a certain bull which is going to be slaughtered is infected

Jackson6612 — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 18:57:43 GMT

Suppose, a certain bull which is going to be slaughtered is infected with several diseases. Before cooking meat is thoroughly washed. Though blood is the main carrier of pathogens, it is still not certain all the blood has been washed away.

Q1: What does a certain mean in the below text or generally? If its use is not justified in the given context then where else is it used?
Q2: Is where else a right word?
Q3: Should a comma be used between cooking and meat? I believe it would be better to use even if it's not necessary.
Q4: What word, certain or sure, would be better to use in the expression not certain all?
Q5: Should that be used between not certain and all?

Memos show Clinton turmoil

Jackson6612 — Wed, 13 Aug 2008 15:05:10 GMT

Memos show Clinton turmoil

Question: I would have written ''Clinton's turmoil''. Why didn't the author use apostrophe?

BY CRAIG GORDON AND TOM BRUNE | <email addresses removed by mod.>
August 13, 2008

Question: Why is semicolon used instead of comma to separate the email addresses above?

WASHINGTON - In a fresh postmortem (=an examination of a plan or event that failed, done to discover why it failed, =autopsy) on Hillary Rodham Clinton's presidential bid (=attempt to obtain or do something), newly published staff memos (=a short official note to another person in the same company or organization) and e-mails reveal a campaign hobbled (=to hobble something or someone means to make it more difficult for them to be successful or to achieve what they want) by internal rivalries (=a situation in which two or more people, teams, or companies are competing for something), faulty planning, bloated (=more than needed, =excessive) spending - and perhaps most important, Clinton's own failure to make the hard decisions.

Clinton offered herself to voters as a hyper-competent (=extra competent) executive ready to be president from day one. But atop (=on top of something) her own campaign, she was a hesitant leader, who allowed bitter infighting (=when members of the same group or organization argue, or compete with each other in an unfriendly way) to fester (=If an argument or bad feeling festers, it continues so that feelings of hate or dissatisfaction increase) among staffers over whether to go negative against Barack Obama, according to the Atlantic magazine.

The most bare-knuckled (=characterized by disorderly action and disregard for rules) lines of attack came from Clinton's chief strategist, Mark Penn, who urged Clinton to highlight Obama's "lack of American roots" due to his upbringing in Indonesia and Hawaii - saying he could only win if he faced Attila the Hun ((?406-453 AD) a king of the Huns (=an ancient people from Asia) who attacked and took control of large parts of the Roman Empire. He is famous for being violent and cruel).

But Clinton didn't embrace Penn's flag-waving (=the expression of strong national feelings, especially when these feelings seem too extreme) approach (=way of doing something), which campaign aides (=someone whose job is to help someone who has an important job, especially a politician) insist was never seriously considered.

Question: Clinton didn't embrace Penn's approach because she did not consider it seriously. Therefore, what campaign aides were saying is redundant.

The article also says that Clinton at times grew frustrated and short-tempered - including on the morning after her stunning third-place finish in Iowa in January, when aides on a call were silent. Clinton's camp dismissed the story as "inside-the-Beltway gossip" and "old news." And former campaign aides sharply disputed the notion of Clinton as an indecisive leader, with one campaign veteran saying, "Nobody seems to want to remember the fact that we had so many successes and come-from-behind victories in this campaign ... and they are due in large part to Senator Clinton's leadership."

Question: What does the line including on the morning...when aides on a call were silent mean? If she finished third place, then why would the author describe it as stunning? What does call mean in when aides on a call were silent?

Question: What does the phrase inside-the-Beltway gossip mean?

Question: What does the line Nobody seems to want to remember...to Senator Clinton's leadership'' mean?

But the e-mails and memos offer vivid (=very clear and detailed) new details about what had long been reported - that Clinton's headquarters was beset (=to make someone experience serious problems or dangers) by caustic (=bitter) internal battles involving Penn and former President Bill Clinton, who wanted to forcefully attack Obama, and others who wanted the New York senator to take a more positive tack (=method, =way of doing something). At one point, it was Bill Clinton - and not Hillary - who approved the famed 3 a.m. phone call ad.

Question: what had long been reported is passive past perfect tense. Am I right?

Question: I think headquarters should take plural verb. What do you say?

Question: Why are the hyphens used in -and not Hillary-? I believe commas would do instead?

Adding to the turmoil was the fact that the campaign had little strategy and no money left to seriously compete in the post-Super Tuesday contests - having (=the form having with a past participle can be used to introduce a clause in which you mention an action which had already happened before another action began) burned through $106 million before Iowa. That allowed Obama to win 12 straight contests and effectively wrap up (=to finish a job, meeting etc) the nomination.

Question: What does burned through mean?

In the end, the campaign's strategy came to reflect some of the internal turmoil, as Clinton veered (=changed course) from attacking Obama to emphasizing her personal side.

Question: What does her personal side mean?

Penn did offer some advice in March 2007 that proved on the mark - Clinton's path to victory lay with women and lower- and working-class voters.

Question: What does proved on the mark mean? I couldn't find it in the dictionary.

But by the time Clinton finally settled on that strategy to win the later primaries, it was too late.

Excerpts from the memos

"All of these articles about his boyhood in Indonesia and his life in Hawaii are geared towards showing his background is diverse, multicultural and putting that in a new light ... It also exposes a very strong weakness for him - his roots to basic American values and culture are at best (=even when considered in the most positive way) limited. I cannot imagine America electing a president during a time of war who is not at his center fundamentally American in his thinking and in his values." Strategist Mark Penn, from a March 19, 2007, memo to Hillary Rodham Clinton advising her to attack Barack Obama for his "lack of American roots."

Question: What does centre mean in the above context?

"The right knows Obama is unelectable except perhaps against Attila the Hun, and a third party would come in then anyway." Penn, from the same memo.

Question: Does right refer to right wing in the above context?

"This has been a very instructive call, talking to myself." Clinton, before angrily hanging up on a staff conference call the day after coming in third in Iowa in January. "She complained of being outmaneuvered (=to gain an advantage over someone by using cleverer or more skilful plans or methods) in Iowa and being painted as the establishment candidate," according to the Atlantic - but was met with near-silence.

Question: I would have written This has been..., talking to me. Why did she use myself?

Question: What is a conference call? Is it some kind of telephone call which address many poeple?

Question: Why is in used in coming in third?

"STOP IT!! I have help my tongue for weeks. After this morning's WP story, no longer. This makes me sick. This circular firing squad that is occurring is unattractive, unprofessional, unconscionable, and unacceptable ... It must stop." Robert Barnett, a Clinton lawyer and Washington insider, from a March 6, 2008, e-mail to campaign staff after a Washington Post story detailed the infighting.

Question: What does I have help my tongue for weeks mean?

Question: What does This circular firing squad mean?

Question: Were the comments in the last paragraph made by Robert Barnett?

Re: I MADE AN EXERCISE BUT I'M NOT SURE WITH ANSWERS, CAN ANYONE CHECK IT?

Philip — Tue, 12 Aug 2008 15:22:13 GMT

This is quite an assignment, and you have made a great attempt. I'll try to make corrections, assuming I understand the instructions.

5: some would prefer "the summit of which", avoiding the human element of 'whose'

6: [this one has me baffled!]

8: I recommended [that] he do the task.

10: comma after 'letter'

12: crying only because

13: [I cannot come up with a conditional sentence using 'but for' here]

I don't know what your native language is, but I suspect you may have a verb [It. fare; Sp. hacer; Fr. faire) that is the equivalent of many expressions in English that use do or make. In this case, we do an exercise, while the teacher has made the exercise.