Search results for 'tag:Genders tag:American English' matching tags 'Genders' and 'American English'

Re: Please check my grammar

Anonymous — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 05:23:27 GMT

If this sentence originated in the U.S., then failure to make the number (that is, the singularity or plurality) of the pronoun (in this case "their") match the number of the noun (in this case ''seller") is the result of what is termed "political correctness." Because of this flawed concept, many poor writers now use this grammatical construction in their efforts to avoid refernce to gender, even though they know that the proper grammar is to use "his" or "her." Their thinking is that pointing out that the seller is male or female might have bad consequences of some sort. I have never understood why such ridiculous delicacy came to be standard practice, and I think such perversion of English is the result of muddy thinking promulgated by badly educated businesspeople. Your doubt is perfectly valid. -- An American English speaker from birth, and a proffreader by profession

Re: What makes English so difficult to learn?

Anonymous — Wed, 13 Feb 2008 18:34:01 GMT

Hello, another English teacher here. I have been teaching English in China for about 2 and a half years now and also speak fluent French, decent Spanish and am learning Chinese (not as hard as you may think once you get the hang of those tones, easy grammar). Now I'll start off by saying that English seems to be an incredibly easy language to communicate with (and by this I mean to give the general idea of what you're trying to say). However, if you want to learn English like a native speaker then it's a completely different story. The pronunciation CAN be difficult to learn depending on your native language and also the age you attempt to learn it at. Training your tongue and mouth to move the same way a native speaker does can be difficult to do, especially if you're like many of my students who got their start at an older age or didn't have good teachers. I've also noticed that my younger students are able to mimic my speech much easier than the older ones speaking, both of whom are studying at the same level. I started learning French when I was 4 years old (Quebec French, I'm Canadian) and because of the quality of my teachers and my young age I was able to become quite good with my pronunciation. With my Chinese because I'm learning from scratch from native speakers my pronunciation is also decent (notice I said decent, not great, although when speaking Chinese I'm always understood). Native language has a lot to do with it too as the sounds you use in one language may be very different for another. I've taught in both the north and south of China and find that the people all have the same problems. Chinese people have problems with s (they often pronounce it as a sh sound) and with closing their mouth for the letter m ("sometimes" is a nightmare for them and they often say it like "suntine"). L and R can also be troublesome. One can't forget sentence stress as well as well as linking words together to make it go smoothly.

The vocabulary can also be a pain. Someone here mentioned 150,000 words in the English language but the number is actually much higher. The Oxford English Dictionary (2nd edition) contains over 600,000 definitions. Webster's Third New International Dictionary, Unabridged contains 475,000 main headwords and it is believed the language grows by 25,000 words a year. Don't believe me, check Wikipedia. There's also the difference in spelling and vocabulary between the different forms of English. British English and American English use different words and the words that are the same can be spelled differently. American English and Canadian English essentially share the same vocabulary to a large degree but the spelling of Canadian English in many ways is closer to British English. British English is pretty much the English form most Asian and European countries will learn but American pop culture will also have an influence, not to mention the American economy and it's impact. This can all be very confusing. To the person saying they are tired of using "well" as in "well, then..." there are many substitutes you could use.

The grammar is also a nuisance. It's not the hardest of things but certainly isn't the easiest. Sure French has a gender attached to all of it's nouns (which I hated when learning it), but English still has more exceptions to it's rules that need to me memorized. So many even native speakers have trouble with it. A language like Chinese that may seem hard to speak actually has very simple grammar. For example if you wanted to ask someone where they are you would say "ni zai na li" or simply "ni zai nar" (you where?). To ask a question in Chinese you merely ad "ma" to the end of a statement. "Ta hui shuo zhongwen" is "he/she speaks Chinese whereas "ta hui shuo zhongwen ma" is "does he/she speak Chinese?". Also in Chinese as there are no forms of he or she.

It's impossible to say which language is easy and which is hard when compared to each other because there are so many things that need to be taken into consideration. Let's just say that English has it's easy parts and it's ridiculously difficult parts as well. Speaking at a native speaker level can be done and I know people who have done this, but it takes a lot of hard work, good instruction, and a good learning atmosphere. I hope all that made sense, I stumbled onto this site a 2 in the morning and am quite tired.

gender of blond / brunet / gay ?

Xinelo — Fri, 07 Sep 2007 12:57:08 GMT

I move this query to a new post.

According to the Merriam Webster dictionary (which I think is American, but I don't actually know whether this is a prescriptive or descriptive dictionary), blond as a noun is used of a male and blonde when used of a female. The same applies to brunet vs. brunette: the former is used to refer to a male and the latter to a female. My question is: whatever the dictionary says, how normal is it to read "he's a blond" or "he's a brunet". I'm not referring to the spelling but to the actual word. Would a regular American English-speaker say ever that? (for example a journalist in a news article).

Regarding the word gay as a noun: it would be expected to be the gender-indefinite counterpart of straight, but is it really? Can it be used interchangeably both for males and females? Could you say "she's a gay"? Or is it only used of males, actually functioning as the masculine counterpart of lesbian?

As I said, I care about real usage rather than about what the dictionary says...

Thanks a lot for your attention and/or help!

Cheers, Manuel

Re: fellow / bloke / etc.: masculine or indefinite??

Feebs11 — Fri, 07 Sep 2007 00:06:19 GMT

Xinelo wrote:
I'd like to add some other words to the list.

According to the Merriam Webster dictionary (which I think is American, but I don't actually know whether this is a prescriptive or descriptive dictionary), blond as a noun is used of a male and blonde when used of a female. The same applies to brunet vs. brunette: the former is used to refer to a male and the latter to a female. My question is: whatever the dictionary says, how normal is it to read "he's a blond" or "he's a brunet". I'm not referring to the spelling but to the actual word. Would a regular American English-speaker say ever that? (for example a journalist in a news article).

Regarding the word gay as a noun: it would be expected to be the gender-indefinite counterpart of straight, but is it really? Can it be used interchangeably both for males and females? Could you say "she's a gay"? Or is it only used of males, actually functioning as the masculine counterpart of lesbian?

As I said, I care about real usage rather than about what the dictionary says...

Thanks a lot for your attention and/or help!

Cheers, Manuel

A new thread would be a good thing if you have more than one query.

However, yes, you will see/hear "blond". I have never in fact come across "brunet" as an adjective.

"Gay" as a euphemism for "homosexual" is gender-indefinite.

Re: fellow / bloke / etc.: masculine or indefinite??

Xinelo — Thu, 06 Sep 2007 20:27:43 GMT

I'd like to add some other words to the list.

According to the Merriam Webster dictionary (which I think is American, but I don't actually know whether this is a prescriptive or descriptive dictionary), blond as a noun is used of a male and blonde when used of a female. The same applies to brunet vs. brunette: the former is used to refer to a male and the latter to a female. My question is: whatever the dictionary says, how normal is it to read "he's a blond" or "he's a brunet". I'm not referring to the spelling but to the actual word. Would a regular American English-speaker say ever that? (for example a journalist in a news article).

Regarding the word gay as a noun: it would be expected to be the gender-indefinite counterpart of straight, but is it really? Can it be used interchangeably both for males and females? Could you say "she's a gay"? Or is it only used of males, actually functioning as the masculine counterpart of lesbian?

As I said, I care about real usage rather than about what the dictionary says...

Thanks a lot for your attention and/or help!

Cheers, Manuel

Re: How to refer to someone whose sex is unknown

Clive — Fri, 17 Nov 2006 22:52:38 GMT

Hi,

There's something I really don't know: what's the usual, common, informal way to refer to someone whose gender unknown? I know that when the person is not identified we use they (someone, anyone, nobody, etc. - Example: Someone left their book here), and we also use they when speaking in general (a person, a doctor, etc. Example:The user can write their comment here). Yes.

But the real problem is, what if the person is a specific person and I don't know if they (they? ) are a male or a female? Here's a few examples:

your doctor, your cousin, your teacher... Ex: A:My cousin fell off a ladder - B: I hope they are all right! I'd probably default to saying 'he'. The speaker may not consider it's important to correct me. If they do want to correct me, they just say something like 'It's my sister's daughter' or 'She didn't get hurt badly'.
the next president of the US, the new doctor... Ex: Dr. Jone moved. There should be a new doctor now. I hope they are friendly. ditto
the killer, the suspect, the terrorist, the author... Ex: There seems to be a killer in town, they have killed nine girls so far. In real life, these killers are usually male.
the nurse, that truck driver, that police officer... Ex:The nurse changed the drip while I was sleeping. I'm sure they'll be back to change the dressing later. Most nurses are women, so I'd probably say 'she'. /// Ex: A:I heard that a secretary was killed yesterday here in LA..- B: Were they working at YummyYummy Inc.? 'They' sounds OK here. One's choice is often just idiomatic.
Dr. Brown, Professor Jone... Ex: Tomorrow Dr. Brown is visiting our laboratory. They will also explain how to make an atomic bomb. Default to 'he'.
Nicknames, ambiguous names or foreign names: NM456, PrettyChick79, Chris, Alerania Muhusabanu... Ex:There's a new user, Kooyeen. -- Who are they? -- I don't know, they said they are learning American English. 'They' sounds OK.
...and many more cases!

Best wishes, Clive

How to refer to someone whose sex is unknown

Kooyeen — Fri, 17 Nov 2006 16:41:11 GMT

Hi

There's something I really don't know: what's the usual, common, informal way to refer to someone whose gender unknown? I know that when the person is not identified we use they (someone, anyone, nobody, etc. - Example: Someone left their book here), and we also use they when speaking in general (a person, a doctor, etc. Example:The user can write their comment here).

But the real problem is, what if the person is a specific person and I don't know if they (they? ) are a male or a female? Here's a few examples:

your doctor, your cousin, your teacher... Ex: A:My cousin fell off a ladder - B: I hope they are all right!
the next president of the US, the new doctor... Ex: Dr. Jone moved. There should be a new doctor now. I hope they are friendly.
the killer, the suspect, the terrorist, the author... Ex: There seems to be a killer in town, they have killed nine girls so far.
the nurse, that truck driver, that police officer... Ex:The nurse changed the drip while I was sleeping. I'm sure they'll be back to change the dressing later. /// Ex: A:I heard that a secretary was killed yesterday here in LA..- B: Were they working at YummyYummy Inc.?
Dr. Brown, Professor Jone... Ex: Tomorrow Dr. Brown is visiting our laboratory. They will also explain how to make an atomic bomb.
Nicknames, ambiguous names or foreign names: NM456, PrettyChick79, Chris, Alerania Muhusabanu... Ex:There's a new user, Kooyeen. -- Who are they? -- I don't know, they said they are learning American English.
...and many more cases!

I'm interested only in common usage (or informal, everyday usage), not formal usage (I know that in formal usage I should use "he or she" or rephrase). So I'd like to know how native speakers, especially from the US, cope with that problem in everyday life. Do you use they, he, or even she in case you are talking about a certain secretary or nurse? I hope you understand my problem, I'm so confused

PS: I already asked something similar in this forum, but the examples in question were too specific. I'd like to get back to this topic from a more general point of view.

Thank you in advance