Search results for 'tag:Nouns tag:Dialects' matching tags 'Nouns' and 'Dialects'

Re: One of many problems faced by English learners is their own misconceptions.

AlpheccaStars — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 02:57:01 GMT

Jackson6612
Avangi
either "learners of the English language," or "English language learners."

Why is article the essential here? There is only one English language. e.g. I'm learning Chinese language these days. Is there any need to specify Chinese language using the? The use of the is justified in sentences as in ''I'm learning the Southern American English dialect nowadays.

Avangi, Jackson:

The rule is that articles (definite, indefinite) are omitted in the case of mass nouns (non-count), and required for count nouns.

"Language" is a count noun. Thus, I can say: I speak two languages - Spanish and Greek.

I am studying the language of the tribal peoples of Tanzania.

When English, Chinese, Polish, Russian, etc. are adjectives modifying "language", you say:

I am studying the Russian language.

In contrast, English (as well as Polish, Russian, Chinese) is a mass (non-count ) noun.

So then you can omit the definite article (the):

I am studying English, Chinese and Russian.

I am a native speaker of English.

There are exceptions: Fowler wrote a book on grammar titled: The King's English

But this is distinguishing the King's English from other Englishes (American, the Queen's, Old English, Middle English etc.)

Re: One of many problems faced by English learners is their own misconceptions.

Avangi — Mon, 17 Nov 2008 23:27:00 GMT

Jackson6612

Avangi
either "learners of the English language," or "English language learners."
Why is article the essential here? There is only one English language. e.g. I'm learning Chinese language these days. Is there any need to specify Chinese language using the? The use of the is justified in sentences as in ''I'm learning the Southern American English dialect nowadays. The article is required in all of these. I honestly have no idea why. My guess is that "language" is the object of the verb "to learn," and would require an article if it were used without "English" as a modifier. To qualify for standing without the article, a "subject of study" must be one of a few very well-established courses. "I'm majoring in Romance Languages at university." Here, Romance Languages is the recognized name of a well-established course of study, as is Chinese. In the case of a dialect, the indefinite article would be used if there were more than one. Avangi
<<One - - is their own misconceptions.>> IMO there should be number agreement here. Possibly, "One - - - is dealing with their own misconceptions."
Yes, there should be number agreement between verb and object. If I followed your suggestion then the sentence would read: One of many problems faced by learners of the English language is that they are dealing with their own misconceptions. Is that what you suggested? That would be fine. I was considering "that they are" to be optional, as the gerund "dealing" may serve by itself as predicate nominative following the being verb "is." Avangi
This is about "learners." You refer back five times with "they." At some point you might remind the reader who "they" are. Eg, "these learners," "the students," something else of your choosing.
Is choosing'' used as a present participle in the above context? I'd say functionally it's a gerund, serving as object of the preposition "of." The other option, "choice," would of course be a noun.
Avangi
<<During the learning process, they should stop taking the machinery of their native tongue for granted.>> As the final sentence of the first paragraph, this seems enigmatic. It's very well phrased, but the meaning is less than obvious (to me.) I feel like I want an additional sentence by way of (=as means of, as a type of) explanation, or clarification. Optionally, you could make your "machinery" image a little easier to connect up.
How can I make the machinery image a little easier to connect up? How did I know you were going to ask me that danged question?? During the learning process they should remind themselves that the machinery of their native tongue was a long time in [the] building and fine-tuning, and they must be willing to devote an equal effort to the new language. (I'm not sure I have your intention right.)
Avangi
In the second paragraph, at first blush (=when first thought of or considered) the antecedent (=a word or phrase which a pronoun refers back to) of "They" would seem to be "English speakers."
Yes, you are right. I will be more careful about such constructions in future.
Avangi
Have you verified that "idiomaticness" is a word? Or is it a "nonce (=occurring, used, or made only once or for a special occasion) word"?
It is a proper word according to the Merriam-Webster's dictionary.

Congratulations on your hard work. - A.

Edit. "Why is the article "the" essential here?"

Re: One of many problems faced by English learners is their own misconceptions.

Jackson6612 — Mon, 17 Nov 2008 22:13:32 GMT

Hi Avangi,

Avangi
either "learners of the English language," or "English language learners."

Why is article the essential here? There is only one English language. e.g. I'm learning Chinese language these days. Is there any need to specify Chinese language using the? The use of the is justified in sentences as in ''I'm learning the Southern American English dialect nowadays.

Avangi
<<One - - is their own misconceptions.>> IMO there should be number agreement here. Possibly, "One - - - is dealing with their own misconceptions."

Yes, there should be number agreement between verb and object. If I followed your suggestion then the sentence would read: One of many problems faced by learners of the English language is that they are dealing with their own misconceptions. Is that what you suggested?

Avangi
This is about "learners." You refer back five times with "they." At some point you might remind the reader who "they" are. Eg, "these learners," "the students," something else of your choosing.

Is choosing'' used as a present participle in the above context?

Avangi
<<During the learning process, they should stop taking the machinery of their native tongue for granted.>> As the final sentence of the first paragraph, this seems enigmatic. It's very well phrased, but the meaning is less than obvious (to me.) I feel like I want an additional sentence by way of (=as means of, as a type of) explanation, or clarification. Optionally, you could make your "machinery" image a little easier to connect up.

How can I make the machinery image a little easier to connect up?

Avangi
In the second paragraph, at first blush (=when first thought of or considered) the antecedent (=a word or phrase which a pronoun refers back to) of "They" would seem to be "English speakers."

Yes, you are right. I will be more careful about such constructions in future.

Avangi
Have you verified that "idiomaticness" is a word? Or is it a "nonce (=occurring, used, or made only once or for a special occasion) word"?

It is a proper word according to the Merriam-Webster's dictionary.

Re: Apostrophe or not an apostrophe - that is the question.

igbruce — Tue, 11 Nov 2008 09:34:42 GMT

No. A 'thank you' is a colloquial compound noun, like lounge room or room heater, and the 's' in 'thank yous' signifies the plural, so no apostrophe is used.
Apostrophes are used to express possession e.g. Bob's car; or to indicate some letters have been omitted in a contracted word
e.g. 'can't' is a contracted form of 'cannot'. The only exception to the possessive use is with the pronoun 'it'. When 'it' owns something it is spelled 'its', written as 'it's' it is a contracted form of 'it is' e.g. It's raining in Sydney tonight. I think you are confusing what you have written as 'you's' with the slang term for plural 'you'. 'You' has the same form in singular and plural e.g. You have a nice smile; You all heard that; but some slang usages employ a separate word for the plural, usually written as 'youse'.You never say 'youse' unless you are in a gang or something where a slang dialect is used. It is not an accepted English word and signifies that the user comes from a social strata that is very low class or gang oriented.

Ian

Re: hurt

AlpheccaStars — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 19:46:39 GMT

Hurt is most common (My spine hurts, my leg hurts)

Ache is OK too to describe a dull, throbbing, continuous kind of hurting (my head aches; my tooth aches, my muscles ache) Don't use "me" after ache.

Pain is a very old fashioned synonym (as a verb) for hurt. It is not used anymore in standard English (US), except to express mental stress. It is used colloquially a lot in India, Africa, and other English dialects to express physical pain. (My leg pains me.)

Pain is very common and correct to use as a noun.

Re: Lack of emphasis on NPs in ESL

Kooyeen — Sun, 14 Sep 2008 20:38:55 GMT

I obviously agree with Forbes: it depends on your first language. I have never had any problems with passive sentences, subjects and objects, the difference between countable and uncountable, etc. because those are all features I have in Italian too. It is not difficult at all for me to use conditional structures (= modal verbs) in polite requests, like in "Could you lend me 1,000 dollars?", because very similar structures are used the same way in Italian too. On the other hand, I know some Asian languages don't even have past or future tenses, so it's easy to imagine how much more difficult it must be for them to learn English.

So instead of focusing on noun phrases, shouldn't we rather focus on the real difficulties, which happen to vary from learner to learner according to their native language and past experience with languages in general?

Anonymous

How about this student?

<<I assume many of you have watched the cartoon "Totally spies", right?
I just wonder why it is "Totally" here. "totally" is always an adverb, so what do they imply when using "totally" here? How can it go with the noun "spies"?>>>

Heh, good question! I don't know! Could somebody tell me more about that, as a side note here without going completely off topic? Otherwise I will open another thread. I would say "Total spies", but if I suspect that "totally" in "Totally spies" is used informally in some dialects to mean "definitely", like in, like " Are you, like, coming to my awesome party tonight? - Oh, yeah, totally!"
If that is the case, then I don't think that "totally" has anything to do with proving learners have trouble with noun phrases. It would suggest learners have trouble with informal English, and if you ask me, that's true.

Re: if you were

Kooyeen — Sun, 03 Aug 2008 20:35:05 GMT

Grammar Geek
Although I'd say "It was him" more readily than "It was he" as a stand-alone sentence, once you put the "who suggeseted it" part on, I go back to the nominative

Then I don't know. There might be regional and dialectal differences. I'm sure the object pronoun is often used in those sentences, but if it doesn't sound good to you, then its usage is maybe not as widespread as I thought (or at least not in all dialects).

N2G

I like him (not he)

This topic is getting very interesting and at the same time worrying (what I've learned could be wrong!)

Yes! If you go to Jamaica, you'll find out you should say Me like him! Although "I like him" should be ok in high or middle registers.

Re: Medical English/mature teacher

Anonymous — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 02:40:02 GMT

Dear Loretta: Thank-you for your letter. It is always interesting to hear from someone with a similar background or interest. Let me answer some of your questions for you. I want to share with you what I have learned over the years in this business. I hope I can be blunt? 1) You asked: what is the value of these certifications if one is already fluent in english and has taught professionals as part of their professional career? I teach adults at work all the time. My response: This is a common question for people who want to teach at any an all levels of ESL. a) Simply being fluent in a language doesnât make you good at it. Think of all the regional dialects and inner city dialects of English just in the USA alone. Surely to goodness you can see this? This question (and I know from experience) is perceived as incredibly rude and un-knowing by those people who have spent the time, effort and dedication learning how to teach language. b) I am on faculty teaching nursing in a university program, full time. There is a great deal of difference in teaching in a program and curriculum (particularly a program that moves in a lengthy step wise progression) than there is in teaching patient groups and communities in short programs. I have done both of these (because I am a nurse) and am able to compare and contrast the two. c) This statement could be perceived as diminishing the importance of teaching programs everywhere. It suggests that just because a nurse has experience âteaching adults at work all the timeâ that he/she might just as well apply for a teaching job in general education! Can you see where I am going with this? Ouch. It devalues the importance of undergraduate, graduate and PhDs/MEds in education. What if the teachers were to say this about nursing? d) What is the value? Well, if you wish to teach in a school of any merit, you will need this type of credential, for the reasons I have just cited. If you donât mind teaching at âany old language schoolâ of questionable repute and wages, then the credential isnât necessary. Please donât let that discourage you. You can always, always find work without the TESL certification and this is a FANTASTIC WAY to see the world. FANTASTIC. It just depends on your personal plans. 2) You asked: if I have a web-based business for international students, do I still need TESL certification if I am not traveling abroad to teach? My response: no, you donât really ever NEED to have the TESL, as Iâve said. But having it will improve your credibility exponentially. Just in closing, Iâd like to share a bit about myself so that you will see I am speaking from experience. I am a native English speaker. I studied French in school. I started my young adult years teaching English at Berlitz School of Languages and this helped pay for part of my nursing education. In later years, I picked up the TESL Certificate because I wanted to travel and work teaching English. Then I picked up Spanish! Throughout all of this, I have been a career nurse & nursing instructor first and foremost. I have a post-graduate diploma in Adult Education and a Masters of Science in Administration (Health focus). In the next couple of months I will graduate with a Masters of Education in TESOL. I believe I have a very, very solid background in language studies, adult education and nursing combined. That is why I have been able to build up a reputation for English for Nurses and English for Medical Purposes worldwide. Loretta, you have a fabulous background in Nursing and I would really like to encourage you to pursue your idea to teach Medical English. Those of us who are dually trained (Nursing and ESL) are very, very rare. Itâs a challenging but rewarding niche market to get into! Yours very truly, Melodie Hull, RPN, MSC, BA, TESL, PID, MED (candidate) Nurse-Educator & Consultant Canada Ps: Yikes, just one more thing. If you wish to be seen as a credible English language teacher, you must, must use proper grammar and capitalize titles, names and proper nouns as appropriate, especially if you are posting on the web. (Just a friendly hint.) MH

Hisself instead of himself.

WANG CHUN — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 06:37:12 GMT

Hello

I wonder why some nonstandard dialects of English use the reflexive pronouns hisself instead of himself.

Thank you for your answer.

Re: correct sentence??

Ruslana — Sun, 09 Sep 2007 10:29:06 GMT

From answers.com:

Speakers of some vernacular American dialects, particularly in the South, may use the possessive reflexive form hisself instead of himself (as in He cut hisself shaving) and theirselves or theirself for themselves (as in They found theirselves alone). These forms reflect the tendency of speakers of vernacular dialects to regularize irregular patterns found in the corresponding standard variety. In Standard English, the pattern of reflexive pronoun forms shows slightly irregular patterning; all forms but two are composed of the possessive form of the pronoun and âself or âselves, as in myself or ourselves. The exceptions are himself and themselves, which are formed by attaching the suffix âself/âselves to the object forms of he and they rather than their possessive forms. Speakers who use hisself and theirselves are smoothing out the pattern's inconsistencies by applying the same rule to all forms in the set. â¢ A further regularization is the use of âself regardless of number, yielding the forms ourself and theirself. Using a singular form in a plural context may seem imprecise, but the plural meaning of ourself and theirself is made clear by the presence of the plural forms ourâ and theirâ. Hisself and theirselves have origins in British English and are still prevalent today in vernacular speech in England.

I'm for the Standard English.