Ok, this thread is becoming a mess, it was my fault, I'm so sorry... Well, let's try to distinguish those sounds, with the help of some audio files: IPA / æ / XSAMPA / { / Example: cat /kæt/ - http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cat IPA / ɛ

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Interesting examples. Those are one (sic) syllable words for me. . . . Two syllables for me; no diphthong. But they all have about the same quantity! so to say that has oneof something but has two ... to say that Miss Moore's syllable-count

So too for me. "Theater" and "idea" (each two syllables) are, I think, the only words where I have a diphthong /i@/. Really? Did you mean to exclude words where that sound does not have primary stress (e.g. "area",

( . . . ) My ears can't detect any difference between the vowels of Bob's "call" and "Bob". I don't (yet) have formant-analysis software on my computer, so without knowing whether the vowels actually are objectively

On Sun, 20 Jul 2003 20:37:08 +0100, "Jonathan Jordan" (Email Removed) said: All true, but whatever it is will probably be ... the vowelthey use in "saw", it's pretty clear and unambiguous. I don't see how you can say

On Sun, 20 Jul 2003 20:37:08 +0100, "Jonathan Jordan" (Email Removed) said: On Sun, 20 Jul 2003 15:44:54 +0300, sand (Email Removed) ... would be ('sO:n@), or maybe ('sA.n@), or maybe something else. All true, but whatever it is