Search results for 'tag:Sentence structures tag:Pronouns' matching tags 'Sentence structures' and 'Pronouns'

Re: Is "There is the ..." an exceptional use?

jazzmaster — Fri, 08 Aug 2008 22:27:58 GMT

CalifJim

Probably not. There may be a better way to finesse this with a different wording.
Yes, but from the viewpoint of the authors and the teacher, this may be considered a harmless "white lie".
Out of curiosity, does the book actually use the words, "serious grammatical error"? Or is that your impressionistic paraphrase?

Thanks CJ

"Serious grammatical error" is my paraphrase. But when and if ESL students start to expressly state "this IS an exceptional usage", I suppose that means "these is a set rule on this and no one can break that in any shape or form".

"the simplification of the grammar at the beginning makes it much easier for them to navigate the language with confidence in the beginning stages" ... I fully concur with your view here. This indeed is the ideal way of teaching something to someone, I would say. However, the reality is that they will soon start feeding what a SVOC is, along with modifier/qualifier, the difference between a relative pronoun and adverb and all that good stuff to students who even cannot pronounce the word "English" correctly yet. I have an impression that they do present "grammatically acceptable" sentence structures, rock-solid rules and what not all at once. It is not a fun way to learn a foreign language. That is why some students grow not to like the subject after short while.

Let's say you are in a store with a hardcore grammatical ESL student, and you say:
*&@!#% !! I just realized I left my wallet home!!
... in stead of saying "It's all right, CJ, here, take $100. You can pay me back tomorrow.", (granting that he/she understood what you said), the ESL student will be too busy thinking "Why did he not say "I HAD left my wallet"? Because he is describing an event that happened obviously prior to the moment "he realized", it should be the past perfect tense, thus "I HAD left". It could be an exceptional use of the "realize ... that ...." structure but I am not sure. Or should I just point out his grammatical mistake?" ... this is the mentality of students who are being taught by those hardcore grammar books, and I am not exaggertating even a bit.

Thanks.

Re: participle as a subject

CalifJim — Sat, 12 Jul 2008 01:48:17 GMT

Cool Breeze
I am walking. Walking is an adjective?

"allegedly" See below.

From Introduction to the Grammar of English (Huddleston, Cambridge Textbooks in Linguistics)

... participles are said to be 'verbal adjectives'.

First example given:

He was telling the truth.

Later:

... a present participle ... allegedly has adjectival properties. I say 'allegedly' because it is difficult to see any significant functional resemblance to an adjective ... [in the first example on the list].

He goes on to say that the -ing words in such examples are clearly verbs, while in other contexts they are clearly adjectives.

_____

With respect to the original question then, I suppose the more accurate description is that participles are either parts of verb phrases or are adjectives. In either case, a participle -- being verb or adjective -- cannot be the subject of a sentence unless it is in the cleft sentence structure, as illustrated earlier in the thread by GG. I think that's the only structure that allows a participle or an adjective to be promoted to the status of a noun phrase so it can be a subject.

At least that's my claim. Maybe someone can provide a counterexample. That would be instructive.

Edit:

'Destroyed' is the best description of that town.

Here a participle (adjective) is promoted to a noun and is the subject of the sentence. So there are cases other than the cleft sentence structure that allow it. Nevertheless, note the quotes. It works in the same way that anything in quotes can be promoted to subject:

'Xygneoowytoeyy' is a nonsense word.

'got into the truck' is not a complete sentence.

_____

Your question opens up a good many sticky points in the terminology. Do we (Can we) talk about certain structures by naming them without regard to their function in context? Or not? Probably not. Is love a noun or a verb? Only context will tell.

Cool Breeze
To hear him sing is an unforgettable experience.

to hear him sing is a sentence with a non-finite verb used as a noun phrase in a higher level sentence. The idea is that the terminological identity of a word or group of words may change depending on which level in a hierarchy of clauses it is considered. At the lowest level of the "tree", to hear is indeed an infinitive (a non-finite verb), but in the context of the whole sentence (higher in the hierarchical tree), to hear him sing is the subject of the main clause, is nominal in nature, and is called a noun phrase. (Infinitives are often nominal in nature, so this is not surprising; for example, [I want + noun phrase] can take either of these forms: I want some pizza. I want to sing.)

Cool Breeze
Using an infinitive as a subject may not be common in American English

Actually, infinitives are used in AmE as subjects. The location geographically or historically has nothing to do with it. But infinitives (and their complement(s), if any), taken together, can make noun phrases.

To be absolutely precise, it is a noun phrase (NP) that must be the subject of a sentence. I oversimplified by saying 'noun or pronoun'.

Re: as

CalifJim — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 04:13:58 GMT

1. I go to the same church as he does. -- good, it seems. OK
2. I go to the same church as him -- could it be correct if we treat 'as' as a preposition? OK. Yes.
3. I go to the same church as he goes to -- long, but good, it seems. OK.
Would you say no.1 is good since in a sentence structure as no.1, the word 'do' or 'does' can be used for any action word like 'go'? Yes. That's right.
Like:
4. I played chess as ~~good~~ well as he does/plays -- I think the pronoun 'him' can work here too. Yes. Yes.

In At this year's prom, I wore the same type of hat as at last year's.
Yesterday, the car I drove to Mike's home was the same (one) as his/the one he has.
I went to the same barber as ~~his/~~ the one he goes to.

as

Anonymous — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 03:32:01 GMT

Hi,

Can you help me to use the word 'as' correctly? The word 'so' is a preposition or a conjunction?
1, I go to the same church as he does. -- good, it seems.
2. I go to the same church as him -- could it be correct if we treat 'as' as a preposition?
3. I go to the same church as he goes to -- long, but good, it seems.
Would you say no.1 is good since in a sentence structure as no.1, the word 'do' or 'does' can be used for any action word like 'go'?
Like:
4. I played chess as good as he does/plays -- I think the pronoun 'him' can work here too.

Are these correct?
In this year's prom, I wore the same type of hat as last year's.
Yesterday, the car I drove to Mike's home was the same one as his/the one he has.
I went to the same barber as his/the one he goes to.

(Unknown 22884)OHHH I FINALLY CAN POST!!!

Jen001 — Fri, 21 Dec 2007 01:51:40 GMT

"The Change of the Characteristics in the passage from The Hours"

The passage from the novel The Hours by Michael Cunningham is intriguing. The passage illustrates the difference between the character's characteristics in different time settings: past and present. This difference is clearly shown through the contrasting structure, imagery and language.

The structure reflects the division of the time setting and helps to contrast the different characteristics. The passage has two paragraphs, each describing the character's thoughts and perception about a same place, of the past and present. The length of each paragraph is different; the one from the past is much longer than the other one from the present. This can be related to each of the paragraph's sentence construction. In the first paragraph, about the past, the lengths of the sentences are very long. The first sentence takes eight lines, lengthened continuously within commas, semi-colons and colons. In fact, in one sentence, there are five commas, five semi-colons and a colon. This overly-continued sentence gives a sense of unfiltered, informal, and unrestricted flowing of thoughts. Moreover, the use of brackets, âsome sort of wood(cedar? Camphor?),â seems to be less sophisticated, compared to using dashes or other punctuations of the same function. However, in the second paragraph of the present, the sentence construction is shown contrastingly. The paragraph starts with a short simple sentence: âShe turns down Bleecker, goes up Thomson.â Also, in this paragraph, there are four sentences in six lines, and three of the four sentences are written in simple sentence, including the example above. Although there are a few commas in some of the sentences, there is no semi-colon, but only a colon in the last sentence. The colon is used in a very appropriate way, functioning to introduce the list of âthingsâ, such as âjewelryâ and âjackets.â Thus, within the brief and concise sentence construction, the character in the present appears to be more mature, filtered and sophisticated than in the past. However, as a result of that, the sense of youthful, unfiltered freedom cannot be found anymore in the present.

In addition to the structure, the contrasting imagery of each paragraph demonstrates further differences of the characteristic in the past and present. As both paragraphs are of the same setting, the image of the same place is described at each time. So, the consistent place makes the comparison between the two more distinctive and reliable. The imagery of the place is very vivid in the past, not only within the visual sense, but also within the auditory and olfactory senses, whereas that of the past only relies on the sense of sight. For example, in the past, âthe neighborhoodâ is depicted as âthe center of something new and wildâ in âthe city where the sound of guitars drifted all nightâ and âwhere the stores â¦ smelled the way â¦ Arab bazaars must smell.â This is detail, imaginative and lively, even the âArab bazaarsâ creates a somewhat mystical and adventurous atmosphere. This interesting and passionate depiction is being minimized in the present into three words: an âimitation of itself.â It is now âa watered-down carnival for tourists,â which gives a sense of inactivity and boredom. Also, the stores now âall sell essentially the same things,â such as âsouvenir T-shirts.â This seems to be dull, with no excitement or creativity or passion. This changed imagery, depicted by the character, rather shows the change in the character's perception. The change in perception is demonstrated more clearly within the notion of the âdoorâ and âalley.â In the past, she says, âif you passed through the wrong door or down the wrong alley you would meet a fate,â however, in the present, she âknows that behind these doors, and down these alleys lies nothing more or less than people living their lives.â In the past, she seems to be more concerned with the 'inner' world of thought or imagination. Whereas in the present, she seems to be more grounded in the external world of physical reality. As like the previously discussed change in the sentence structure, she is now more sophisticated, knowledgeable and realistic than the past. Also, as like the image of the place, her perception changed from the creative, interesting and adventurous to the boring, predictable and filtered way. Thus, the contrasting imagery of the past and present reflects the similar change in the character's perception.

While the structure and the imagery convey the distinctive change in the characteristics of the character, the contrasting use of language supports those differences. More specifically, the diction [dash]shown in the past and the present[dash] is comparable. Reflecting the imagery of the varied senses, the words and expressions used in the past are also varied and animated, such as âincense and richâ and âdung-y dustâ describing the smell of the stores. These two expressions, âincense and richâ and âdung-y dustâ are contrasting; they express the diversity of the object. Moreover, the speaker creates a non-existing adjective, âdung-y.â The extra adding of â-yâ grants a more animated image, and it gives a sense of freedom and even somewhat childishness. The âsmellâ is then described as âsomething fruitily, fertilely rotting.â Again, she creates a non-existing adverb, âfruitily,â expressing the scent rather vividly, which would be sour as it ârots.â The other adverb âfertilelyâ contributes to create a sense of abundance and richness of the imagery. However, the use of those two positive adverbs, modifying the negative verb ârottingâ seems to be oxymoron in âfruit[full]â or âfertile,â as well as the use of adjective âdisreputable,â following ânew and wild.â The oxymoron adds an unpredictable sense to the imagery and hence to the depicter's thoughts. On the other hand, in the present, the adjectives used to describe the âcityâ and the âstores,â are ânothing,â âless,â âsame,â and âstill.â All of them are negative and reflect the boredom, dullness and hopelessness. More significantly, the speaker uses the adverb, âGrotesquelyâ before describing how âthe same bars and coffeehouses are still [th]ereâ, showing the character's cynical characteristic. So does the use of the adjective âcheapâ for the goods at the stores. Thus, in the past, the character uses language interestingly [dash] it is diverse, lively and creative [dash] whereas that of the past is inactive, hopeless and cynical. These differences are directly reflecting the character's contrasting, changed characteristic.

The change of the characteristic seems to be abrupt. As a cause, something would have happened to her, that is not shown in the passage. However, an assumption can be drawn within the evidences from the passage. There is a shift in the first paragraph within âHere,â showing the shifted tense from the past to the past perfect. In the past perfect, there is a scene of Clarissa, the major character, and her boyfriend Richard. She seems to appreciate Richard a lot, for example, she does not use the pronoun 'he' for âRichard,â even though he is the only male character. So, in a sentence, Richard is successively repeated three times, âwith Richard, when Richard â¦ when Richard.â Moreover, she describes his appearance in detail; he âwas nineteen,â âa firm-featured, hard-eyed, not-quite-beautiful dark-haired boy with an impossibly long and graceful, very pale neck.â So, to describe Richard, she combines an adjective and a noun to create a single adjective, such as âhard-eyed.â This shows her seriousness about describing him precisely. His âimpossibly longâ and âvery paleâ neck would seem negative, if not for the complementary adjective âgraceful.â Also, the adverb âimpossiblyâ gives a sense of special and unusual feeling for the person. Besides the use of language, the use of punctuation should also be noted. There are many commas, causing the sentences to seem choppy. This would be imitating the feeling of uncertainty and the tension in the situation. The uncertainty of the situation is shown in the line, ââ¦about what? A kiss? Had Richard kissed her, or had she, Clarissaâ¦,â also the tension created as they âhad certainly argued.â Then, the reason for the âargu[ment]â is explained: âClarissa wanted her freedom and Richard wanted, well, too much.â It is notable that as Richard âwanted â¦ too muchâ relating to the âkiss,â the pronoun 'he' is used as âdidn't he always?â In this case, however, the pronoun 'he' seems to more likely indicate every 'man', rather than particularly âRichard.â Thereafter the paragraph ends, and the paragraph of the present starts. It is not sure whether the abrupt change in Clarissa's characteristic is due to âRichardâ or not. Although it is not, it is evident that Clarissa once considered and cared about him quite specially.

Despite of the uncertain reason, the change in the Clarissa's characteristic from the past to the present is shown clearly throughout the contrasting structure, imagery and language. The characteristic includes the thoughts and perception, which were unrestricted, unfiltered, creative and animated in the past; whereas in the present, they are shown restricted, filtered, dull and inactive. The change is extreme, but no particular evidence for the extremity is being suggested, except the short scene with Richard. Thus, this passage not only introduces the setting and the character, but also evokes the reader's curiosity: What has happened to Clarissa?

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I really really really appreciate for your help... Thank you..!

help me to correct this sentences

EquinoX — Tue, 06 Mar 2007 06:36:42 GMT

Please help me to correct these sentences without modifying the sentence structure at all. I know some sentences are messep up, but just help with the grammar and punctuation. Youe help would be really appreciated.

1.By providing an almost complete story about a carrier womenâs life at the morning until she work gives the reader a picture of how womenâs now are sacrificing their job in order to raise theyâre children back as theyâre supposed to.
2.In the book Mommy Myth by Susan Douglas, which is a professor at the University of Michigan and Meredith Michaels, who teaches philosophy at Smith College, they label the phenomenon as the New Momism (507).
3.The rhetoric part of bringing the book into this article is to have the audience realize that not only the writer it self is bringing up this idea into the society but also other people, such as book writerâs in this case are also concern about this issue.
4.By using a well known and famous company such as PWC, the audience then will realize about the stage of this problem does not only effect the woman itself but it also affects the company where those womenâs work for.
5.Most of the data presented here shows comparison on the changes of woman in the past and the present regarding to their career and jobs.

My teacher suggest that I change some words related to pronouns, possesives, and single plural shift. Thanks.

Re: Why '-ing' in these sentences.

Goodman — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 19:58:35 GMT

Tobias wrote:
I have a question about two sentences.

Half the students misbehaved, including going to karaoke bars.
The outer layer is removed, resulting in white rice.

Why do the highlighted verbs here need to be gerunds? Thanks very much for your comments.

T.

Tobias,

This type of sentence structure with verb+ing as present participle is very common. I agree with others that they were written in an odd tone.

For your questions, since they are similar, I will take the first one and rewrite it as follows just for explanation purpose.

Example Question: Half the students misbehaved, including going to karaoke bars.
Revised: Half the students had bad behaviors, which include drinking and visiting karaoke bars.

Present participle sometimes can be used to link a preceding context, action, noun and pronoun to a definitive statement. Example:

As John arrived home and opened the front door, he was completely stunned to have found a trail of his belongings scattering from his front door all the way to the end of the hallway where his bedroom was.

He stood at the door for a few minutes, seemingly feeling unsure what to do, and pondering on whether he should go into his bedroom to investigate. Finally, being concerned with his own safety, he reached in his pocket for the cellphone, deciding to call the police.

In this passage, I used this structure repeatedly for demonstration purpose so that you can get a sense of the usage. Hope that helps.

Re: longest

PASTEL — Tue, 03 Jan 2006 15:47:14 GMT

Davkett wrote:
Teo wrote:

1. This shop is best for noodles.

2. This shop is the best for noodles.

3. This shop is best for its noodles.

4. This shop is the best for its noodles.

Which of the above sentences do you think is semantically odd or not acceptable?

Interesting test, Teo.

I think no.1 is semantically the oddest. (It sort of sounds like this: if you are a noodle-- [and not a turnip, for instance] --you will like this shop the best.)

No.2-- (also, a tiny bit odd, I think--for the same reason as no.1, but) has more of a suggestion that this is the best shop if you want quality noodles.

No.3-- suggests that the noodles are the best thing in the shop.

No.4-- suggests that this shop is the best shop because of its noodles.

(I hope to see other responders chime in.)

Thank you, Teo, for bringing up such an interesting subject.

And may I chime in?

For the first one, there's a sentence in our extbook that says "Which shop is best for noodles?" Then the possible answer would be "This shop is best for noodles." I thoght it was okay until I saw Teo's third and fourth examples. I questioned the first two sentences. As you said, the shop is best for you if you are a noodle. Here, the sentence structure consists of a subject, a be-verb, an adjective, a preposition and a pronoun.

The shop is best for noodles.

which is similar with

The shop is best for Davkett.

I think the problem lies in this word 'for'. Is it part of the adjective phrase 'be best for'?

The shop is best for noodles.

which has a similar structure with the below,

The shop is famous for noodles.

I hope I'm not making your day darker.

Re: vocabulary + "it"

komountain — Wed, 26 Oct 2005 09:07:41 GMT

(A knock on the door)

Mr. Ko: Who is it?

(No answers. Mr. Ko opens the door and finds no one at the door, so he closes it. A little later, he hears another knock on the door.)

Mr. Ko: Who is it?

(Again, he opens the door and finds no one out there. A minute later he hears yet another knock.)

Mr. Ko: Who is it, knocking the door again and again?

...........................

Put in an indirect question, the last sentence above will be something like:

I really can't tell who it is, knocking the door again and again.

Rather than considering 'it' part of a cleft sentence structure, I'd see it as a demonstrative pronoun.

However, if you add 'that is,' the sentence will be:
I really can't tell who it is that is knocking the door again and again. (Still makes sense, wordy as it is.)

In this case, the functional status of 'it' becomes ambiguous, at least to me. Would it be part of a cleft sentence going together with its partner 'that', or just a demonstrative pronoun, with 'that' being viewed as a relative pronoun whose referent is 'who'? I am not so sure.

Re: Subject and Verb

Mister Micawber — Tue, 21 Jun 2005 01:25:08 GMT

1-- 'that' is the restrictive relative pronoun, not a demonstrative. It heads the adverbial clause modifying the verb 'dig' (='understand).

2-- I suppose so; the original has some structural problems-- you have miscopied or the original is wrong.

3-- 'them' refers to funerals. 'Price' is the subject of 'has'. It is not a particularly clearly written sentence, Jack.

4-- 'Interface' is the delayed subject of 'has'.

5-- The underlined portion is a prepositional phrase acting as a sentence adverbial. 'It' refers to Linux. I admit that the sentence structure is not of the best, but it is reasonably intelligible.

PS: the underlined part may be a nonfinite clause rather than a long prepositional phrase (in which case I don't really know what to call the 'with')-- but the result is the same.