Search results for 'tag:Verbs tag:Subjunctives' matching tags 'Verbs' and 'Subjunctives'

Re: quote and the modal 'should'

Mister Micawber — Tue, 15 Jul 2008 03:23:49 GMT

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Yes, we use 'had to' for past 'must' since the verb is imperfect-- it hasn't a past form for this use.

Should after suggested, etc is a different should-- it is called putative-should, and is a mostly BrE equivalent of the subjunctive:

He suggested that I go to church (subjunctive) = He suggested that I should go to church. (putative should)

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Re: when past perfect is necessary?

Marius Hancu — Mon, 14 Jul 2008 02:49:52 GMT

He looked as if he had seen a ghost.

This is more complicated, because he had seen in this context is not past perfect indicative, but past perfect subjunctive mood here (they have the same form)

Read my posts in that thread:

Re: as if + backshift

where I'm saying among others:

Some prefer to concentrate on the mood here, and forget about the sequence of verbs, because when you have modality around, the tenses/timing are a bit mudied .... and I think that's a reasonable point of view.

Re: Have Vs, Has

Yankee — Sun, 13 Jul 2008 11:37:34 GMT

Hi Anon

I would prefer your second sentence, but both are grammatically correct.

Sentence 1 uses the present indicative of the verb have.
Sentence 2 uses the subjunctive form of have.

Re: would prefer

Mr Wordy — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 17:57:17 GMT

Analysing subjunctives is not my greatest strength, so I HOPE that the following explanation is roughly correct!

(I edited just after posting to correct a typo)

Tuongvan
Can I use WOULD PREFER the same way?i.e.Can I say" I would prefer he went to meet Mr Brown now." instead?

"I would prefer he..." is not a form of words that comes very naturally to me (I would usually say "I would prefer it if he went to meet Mr Brown now.") -- but others may differ. If you do use "I would prefer he...", then strictly speaking I think it should be "I would prefer he go to meet Mr Brown" (this is the subjunctive, see below). The problem is that this sounds rather old-fashioned and stilted (to me), and I'm guessing that this perceived awkwardness influences some people to write "I would prefer he went" instead.

Tuongvan
b/The Pentagon said it would prefer that the withdrawal plan and the education benefits not be considered with the war funding.
Why don't they say'it would prefer that the withdrawal plan and the education benefits would not be considered /were not considered with the war funding.'?

"not be considered" is the subjunctive form, which, to quote from Wikipedia, is "a verb mood that ... is typically used in dependent clauses to express wishes, commands, emotion, possibility, judgment, necessity, or statements that are contrary to fact at present." "Prefer" is one of the verbs that it is used with. Your example with "would not be considered" is unnatural. "were not considered" seems more plausible, and, to be honest, I'm not sure if it's technically correct or not. But anyway, with that form of words I think I would say "would prefer it if the withdrawal plan and the education benefits were not considered with the war funding".

Tuongvan
b/He would prefer she stop calling him "Pacman"
Why don't they say'He would prefer she stopped calling him "Pacman"?

Same reason as above: subjunctive.

Re: Is this ok?

26TMNTJG2PG — Thu, 26 Jun 2008 09:58:15 GMT

A. I'm wondering if you made a reservation that will require me to arrive earlier.
B. I'm wondering if you made a reservation requiring that I arrive earlier.
C. Both are correct (but you may need to argue that both use the Present Indefinite).

To avoid that, you can rewrite the sentences as:
A. I'm wondering if you have made a reservation that will require me to arrive earlier.
B. I'm wondering if you have made a reservation requiring that I arrive earlier.

Also, is this correct?
A. "me' is the ~~direc~~t indirect object of "will require," and "to arrive earlier" is an object complement (and also the direct
object of "will require").
B. "requiring" acts a a subjunctive which requires the use of I "arrive," and no direct object should be used (actually
an object is required or not will depend on whether the verb [finite or non-finite] is used transitively or intransitively).

Re: Grammar rules - check for correctness - a kind teacher please :)

Angle1 — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 12:23:55 GMT

Some another issues to discuss

I saw your old friend, him whom you pointed out at the last meeting

Him whom >> whom

Objective pronoun is redundand, we need only relative pronou

I really donÂ´t know if there is a mistake in this sentence
She flouts her mink coat whenever she goes with us so that we will think she is very wealthy

They threated him like he was their own son

Like >>> as if we have a verb in a comparative sentence, we must use as instead of like

He was >> he were - we need a subjunctive here, but I cannot explain why

Many a box of bananas have been sent to Europe

Many a box + has / many boxes + have

What kind of these structures is commonly used

The two last comeptitors, who had to lose or gain the most were affected deeply

Who had to lose or gain the most >> who had the most to lose or gain

How to explain it? Is this

Were affected deeply >> were deeply affected â the adverb determines the adjective

His serious thoughts were bent irrevocable

Bent irrevocable >> bent irrevocably â But how to explain it??

I think that is everything what I need to to discuss

If you want to discuss only few examples, no problem - I would be glad if you would do anything. Thank you very much for your help

Another subjunctive

Sausages — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 10:43:16 GMT

Hey guys

First time poster here. Be gentle.

I was looking to get an answer to whether the following sentence invokes the subjunctive mood or not:

"There's a chance that I might go back to where I was/were before"

To me, the use of a 'possible future' should make the verb subjunctive, but somehow the sentence just sounds off in my ears; I can't explain it. Anyway, any input is much appreciated. Thanks. :)

Re: The Coca Cola company

Cool Breeze — Wed, 11 Jun 2008 07:56:54 GMT

MaverickK
The correct answer is D. But I still can not understand why is A incorrect?

I think you have encountered a grammar "expert" who has very strong opinions about correct usage and little understanding of anything or anyone who disagrees with him. I once met a British teacher of English, an Oxford University graduate, who thought this is the only way to do it was wrong. In his opinion only this is the only way of doing it was correct. Everyone is entitled to his opinion, of course.

Any good grammar book and/or grammar expert will tell you that after the verb demand both the present subjunctive and should are correct in a that clause:

He demanded that I gravel the sidewalk. He demanded that I should gravel the sidewalk.

Re: Hey Guys, Need Help

Tanit — Mon, 09 Jun 2008 12:37:47 GMT

Hi,

New2grammar
Could you try to convince me why the abrupt change of tense makes sense?

Why should it make sense? After all, we're talking about English grammar!
Anyway, somebody says it's an instance of unreal past ...

BBC Learning English

We sometimes use past tenses to describe things in the present or future that are imagined or unreal.
It's time we went.
We are using It's time... here to say that something is not happening, but it should be happening. Compare also the following:
It's time we left. Our son will be home soon and he doesn't have a house key.
It's about time you started looking for a job. You can't depend on us all the time. It's high time you started to fend for yourself.

...we can use the construction it's time to or it's time for + object + to as alternatives to the unreal use of past forms to express this idea:
It's time for you to think seriously about what you want to do in your life.
It's time you thought seriously about what you want to achieve in your life.
It's time to reflect on how you want your life to proceed.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/learningenglish/grammar/learnit/learnitv347.shtml

UNREAL PAST

The past tense is sometimes used in English to refer to an 'unreal' situation. So, although the tense is the past, we are usually talking about the present, e.g. in a Type 2 conditional sentence:
If an elephant and a mouse fell in love, they would have many problems.
Although fell is in the past tense, we are talking about a hypothetical situation that might exist now or at any time, but we are not referring to the past. We call this use the unreal past.
Other situations where this occurs are:

after other words and expressions like'if'(supposing, if only, what if);
after the verb 'to wish';
after the expression 'I'd rather..'
(http://www.edufind.com/English/Grammar/IF10.cfm)

... and somebody says it's subjunctive. See also:
http://www.englishforums.com/English/ChangingTenses/dqcdx/post.htm
http://www.englishforums.com/English/WhichSentencesAreCorrect/zjbhp/post.htm

Re: Grammar Reference book

Marius Hancu — Sat, 24 May 2008 10:32:20 GMT

This is free, and a classic, esp for BrE:

The King's English
H.W. Fowler
http://www.bartleby.com/116/index.html

It may be old in some areas.

I'm also using:

Curme, George O. (1977). "A Grammar of the English Language". Verbatim. ISBN 0-930454-01-4 (reprint of 1931 edition from D. C. Heath and Company).

The best treatment of subjunctive and verbs I know. The book recommended by many prescriptivists.

Quirk, Randolph; Greenbaum, Sidney; Leech, Geoffrey; Svartik, Jan (1985). "A Comprehensive Grammar of the English Language". Longman. ISBN 0-582-51734-6

The modern bible. More up to date, but I prefer Curme. Both quite expensive.