Search results for 'tag:Word order tag:Speak english' matching tags 'Word order' and 'Speak english'

Re: Germans are rather strange

My2sense — Fri, 23 Dec 2005 10:28:45 GMT

Pemmican wrote:
Wow, this was an interesting post, "english-test"!
But let me make a few additions to your thoughts:

>>When discussing cultural differences between nations I think we should always bear in mind a number of things:
- people have much more in common than sets them apart regardless of their nationality
- there is never such a thing as the 'the Americans, the Russians and the French etc'.
- cross cultural discussions often are based on stereotypes and assumptions

That's been clear from the very beginning - but it was also the kinds of stereotypical thoughts I wanted to know...

>> the vast majority of the movies they watch in cinemas are US American, (as are most TV shows and films) yet, the Germans dub every single film so that you have the impression, it's a German film. In my opinion that's stupid. The German society spends huge amounts of money on teaching every German the English language for years and the result is that they are unable to watch a movie in the original version with German captions/subtitles just like any other European nation does.

The first part is true, yes: Germany dubs nearly every single movie or episode of a series. That's the way it has been for years already. English at school has been a must in Germany for around 25-30 years now -> People aged 40 or older usually cannot speak English or even just a little bit and sometimes it's a hassle concentrating on what happens in the movie while keep looking at the subtitles. We also don't have the impression that an English/American or whatever film seems to be German.I'd say, it's just an easier and more convenient way to watch a movie...
Germany btw is not the only European Country that dubs movies, also France, Spain and Italy do so.
Also: Because of the fact that we dub a lot (and NOT just American movies, but also films and series from all around the world) I'd say there is a variety of movies from many different countries. I hardly think that you can see as many films/series from different countries in the US as you can see in Germany. I've also never heard someone say he knows any more German movies than e.g. "Lola rennt"...

>>Germans don't have their own pop culture. They listen to English pop music without paying any attention to the lyrics - hey, am I supposed to understand anything they sing, it's in English!

That's not true, Germany has its own pop culture - it's just not as big as the English one.
Germany is quite open minded to music and cultural things from different countries, it's not just English songs they play a lot on the radio, but also a lot of French and Spanish or Latino songs.
True is btw that sometimes we don't pay attention to the lyrics which is just because it is often quite difficult to understand, and also, I mentioned it already, some people just can't speak English.
It'd be the same if you'd listen to a German song - you'd just listen without paying attention to the lyrics, wouldn't you?

>>Germans have strange greetings such as 'Mahlzeit' - ask any German to explain the meaning of that stupid and empty expression and all you wll get is a blank face!

What? Nothing else is easier to explain: "Mahlzeit" is the German word for "meal" and is actually mainly used at work, around noon. It means "Enjoy your meal" - similar to the more formal "Guten Appetit".

>> The German language is very inflexible just like its speakers - word order is as strict as many of their laws.

*** The word order in German language is nearly totally free - the only thing you have to keep in mind is the position of the verb, anything else is mainly reigned by one of the four grammatical cases German language has. In English on the other hand, the word order is very strict: Subject, predicate, ocbject! In any case without exception usually.
The English sentence "Yesterday, she went shopping with her friend"
can be expressed in these ways in German:
"Gestern ging sie mit ihrem Freund einkaufen"
"Gestern ging sie einkaufen mit ihrem Freund."
"Sie ging gestern mit ihrem Freund einkaufen."
"Sie ging mit ihrem Freund gestern einkaufen."
"Mit ihrem Freund ging sie gestern einkaufen."
"Einkaufen ging sie gestern mit ihrem Freund."
Wouldn't you say this word order is quite free?

>>Speaking of self-employment: Germany ranks very low regarding the percentage of people being self-employed and thereby taking responsibility for themselves. Especially in East Germany - the former Socialist part of Germany people don't want to take decisions themselves. They wait until they are told what to do by someone else - by an authority, the government, the all mighty Labour Office (Arbeitsamt) ect.

You just mentioned it: It's the former Socialist part of Germany, which was ruled by Russia from 1949-1990. So the Socialist way of thinking is still there and still needs some years to get away. People were used to get orders from the Russian government there and work for the communism - it just needs some time to get totally rid of that, I'd say.

>>Germans spend money on all kinds of things such as holiday trips to Majorca, German cars, tabloids, pay TV, digital cameras, cell phones. Yet, when it comes to education they think that the government has to take care of this. Why should I pay for a further education? What good is education anyway?

I've never been to Mallorca yet (as many Germans haven't), I don't have a car (as I've to say that the German train and bus connections are very well elaborated), I don't have a digital camera, neither pay-TV, but I do have a cell phone. Anyway, I'd say, most of the people want to travel around, to have some luxury goods, that's not just a habit of a single country's population ***
Education is generally free in Germany, and it's also set as a rule in the German Code of Law that education has to be available and affordable for everyone. Schools are for free, there no fees you've to pay to visit a school and just a very small fee to be paid for studying at a university. (<-- This is actually changing at the moment, lots of students are demonstrating against these changings and I hope we'll succeed with these protests.)

Dear pemmican:

Excellent job setting this misguided person straight! Gut gemacht!

Re: Someone and me

miriam — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 11:19:58 GMT

Hello again, Mask.
I musunderstood your question, but I see what you mean now.

Just like many other English words, "than" belongs to more than one class. It is a preposition in sentences like "She is taller than me", and it is a conjunction in sentences like "She is taller than I (am)."
In other words, "than" is regarded as a preposition when it is followed by an object, and it is a subordinating conjunction when it introduces a comparative clause (or a structure that can be expanded into a clause).

I also agree that "but" is mostly used as a conjunction, but in certain constructions it acts as a preposition. It can also be an adverb and a noun.

"And", however, is different. unless it is used in initial position, to join two sentences, it is always a conjunction. And that is not capricious really. "And" is a conjunction because you use it, as was said before, to join two words, phrases, clauses, etc. that have the same grammatical status.

You can say "You and me". But that construction will be correct only if it appears in the right place in an utterance. Unlike other grammars -such as that of my mother tongue- English grammar is based mainly on word order. There are categories (word classes, structures, etc.) which you can use in a certain position in a sentence but which will be incorrect if you move them to a different position... unless you change their form.

Returning to "You and me", it wil be correct if you use that construction in object position for example, but it will be incorrect if you use it as subject. Why? Because "me" is the objective form of the pronoun "I", regardless of whether or not you are using "and".
You say "you and I speak English", and you say "English is spoken by you and me".
There is no doubt that "and" is a conjunction in the first example. Now, if you look at the second example, you will see that "and" has exactly the same function as in the first one. Its function hasn't changed, so it is no necessary to think of a different category for that word. It is joining two words of the same grammatical status in both sentences.
"And" will not become a preposition just because the word that comes after it is an objective pronoun.

I don't know if this is clear enough or if it answers your question. I hope id is, and that is does, though.

Miriam

Re: Germans are rather strange

pemmican — Thu, 04 Dec 2003 17:05:00 GMT

Wow, this was an interesting post, "english-test"!
But let me make a few additions to your thoughts:

>>When discussing cultural differences between nations I think we should always bear in mind a number of things:
- people have much more in common than sets them apart regardless of their nationality
- there is never such a thing as the 'the Americans, the Russians and the French etc'.
- cross cultural discussions often are based on stereotypes and assumptions

That's been clear from the very beginning - but it was also the kinds of stereotypical thoughts I wanted to know...

>> the vast majority of the movies they watch in cinemas are US American, (as are most TV shows and films) yet, the Germans dub every single film so that you have the impression, it's a German film. In my opinion that's stupid. The German society spends huge amounts of money on teaching every German the English language for years and the result is that they are unable to watch a movie in the original version with German captions/subtitles just like any other European nation does.

The first part is true, yes: Germany dubs nearly every single movie or episode of a series. That's the way it has been for years already. English at school has been a must in Germany for around 25-30 years now -> People aged 40 or older usually cannot speak English or even just a little bit and sometimes it's a hassle concentrating on what happens in the movie while keep looking at the subtitles. We also don't have the impression that an English/American or whatever film seems to be German.I'd say, it's just an easier and more convenient way to watch a movie...
Germany btw is not the only European Country that dubs movies, also France, Spain and Italy do so.
Also: Because of the fact that we dub a lot (and NOT just American movies, but also films and series from all around the world) I'd say there is a variety of movies from many different countries. I hardly think that you can see as many films/series from different countries in the US as you can see in Germany. I've also never heard someone say he knows any more German movies than e.g. "Lola rennt"...

>>Germans don't have their own pop culture. They listen to English pop music without paying any attention to the lyrics - hey, am I supposed to understand anything they sing, it's in English!

That's not true, Germany has its own pop culture - it's just not as big as the English one.
Germany is quite open minded to music and cultural things from different countries, it's not just English songs they play a lot on the radio, but also a lot of French and Spanish or Latino songs.
True is btw that sometimes we don't pay attention to the lyrics which is just because it is often quite difficult to understand, and also, I mentioned it already, some people just can't speak English.
It'd be the same if you'd listen to a German song - you'd just listen without paying attention to the lyrics, wouldn't you?

>>Germans have strange greetings such as 'Mahlzeit' - ask any German to explain the meaning of that stupid and empty expression and all you wll get is a blank face!

What? Nothing else is easier to explain: "Mahlzeit" is the German word for "meal" and is actually mainly used at work, around noon. It means "Enjoy your meal" - similar to the more formal "Guten Appetit".

>> The German language is very inflexible just like its speakers - word order is as strict as many of their laws.

*lol* The word order in German language is nearly totally free - the only thing you have to keep in mind is the position of the verb, anything else is mainly reigned by one of the four grammatical cases German language has. In English on the other hand, the word order is very strict: Subject, predicate, ocbject! In any case without exception usually.
The English sentence "Yesterday, she went shopping with her friend"
can be expressed in these ways in German:
"Gestern ging sie mit ihrem Freund einkaufen"
"Gestern ging sie einkaufen mit ihrem Freund."
"Sie ging gestern mit ihrem Freund einkaufen."
"Sie ging mit ihrem Freund gestern einkaufen."
"Mit ihrem Freund ging sie gestern einkaufen."
"Einkaufen ging sie gestern mit ihrem Freund."
Wouldn't you say this word order is quite free?

>>Speaking of self-employment: Germany ranks very low regarding the percentage of people being self-employed and thereby taking responsibility for themselves. Especially in East Germany - the former Socialist part of Germany people don't want to take decisions themselves. They wait until they are told what to do by someone else - by an authority, the government, the all mighty Labour Office (Arbeitsamt) ect.

You just mentioned it: It's the former Socialist part of Germany, which was ruled by Russia from 1949-1990. So the Socialist way of thinking is still there and still needs some years to get away. People were used to get orders from the Russian government there and work for the communism - it just needs some time to get totally rid of that, I'd say.

>>Germans spend money on all kinds of things such as holiday trips to Majorca, German cars, tabloids, pay TV, digital cameras, cell phones. Yet, when it comes to education they think that the government has to take care of this. Why should I pay for a further education? What good is education anyway?

I've never been to Mallorca yet (as many Germans haven't), I don't have a car (as I've to say that the German train and bus connections are very well elaborated), I don't have a digital camera, neither pay-TV, but I do have a cell phone. Anyway, I'd say, most of the people want to travel around, to have some luxury goods, that's not just a habit of a single country's population *hehe*
Education is generally free in Germany, and it's also set as a rule in the German Code of Law that education has to be available and affordable for everyone. Schools are for free, there no fees you've to pay to visit a school and just a very small fee to be paid for studying at a university. (<-- This is actually changing at the moment, lots of students are demonstrating against these changings and I hope we'll succeed with these protests.)