Thanks, Aristocles, for the mainland point of view. Can you tell us the Taiwanese point of view? (Perhaps including the Japanese involvement)?

(as requested) The difference between the two is simply that the latter tells us that the umbrella is in an upright position. "Holding the umbrella up" as opposed to holding the umbrella in some oher position (down, sideways...

I must/have to say; I'm impressed. I don't understand half the stuff you guys are debating, but the half I do is very impressive!

... To tell the truth, I kind of like him. Obama? Give it a little time. He isn't even in office yet. So far we have only seen the friendly advertising! (I'm getting ready for the Fourth Reich)

And how come if we have "into" we don't have "outof"? Have you ever had that feeling that you were a little bit crazy? Or perhaps a LOT CRAZY? Maybe it wasn't just a feeling. Maybe you really are crazy, but maybe

lol... I'm guessing that, like me, you don't get out much. Tonight I will rebell! I will have cornflakes for dinner - late! Tomorrow I will have pizza for breakfast!

As a guitarist Angus Young is pretty good too (though possibly misguided in a Satanic kinda way). The "Who's" part of the question kinda makes me think of individuals as opposed to groups. Ry Cooder! Yay! Dave Gilmour! (Very weird,

I checked the "catenaccio" thingy on Wikipedia, but I am afraid I am none the wiser. Can you explain it? (Pretend I am a six-year-old). Thanks :-)