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Thus spake Adam Entous:

Just how many parts of speech isn't my book telling me about?! Maybe I should upgrade.

Yeah, and we don't call them "parts of speech" any longer, they're "word classes". All this nonsense is simply the linguists creating a market for their wares. It's like the fashion business with its new seasons.

Fashion doesn't progress, so the analogy is fatally flawed. Like any other science, linguistics is self-correcting. If articles are determiners and not adjectives, then new theories in which determiners are adjectives are not going to succeed, because they don't fit the real world.

Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com
Thus spake Raymond S. Wise:
Thus spake Adam Entous: Yeah, and we don't call them ... wares. It's like the fashion business with its new seasons.

Fashion doesn't progress, so the analogy is fatally flawed. Like any other science, linguistics is self-correcting. If articles are determiners and not adjectives, then new theories in which determiners are adjectives are not going to succeed, because they don't fit the real world.

What about the terminology (which is what I was addressing in the above)? What prompted linguists to rename "parts of speech" "word classes"?
Surely you're not going to claim that was a scientific- corrective development.

Simon R. Hughes
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... ... Thanks for an interesting response! However... Should that ... education went on in Europe in Greek, Arabic, and Hebrew.

It certainly did. In my unarguably European now-hometown, that "all" wouldn't even pass muster as "most" or "a lot of " it'd have to be "hardly any".

Do I take it that your now-hometown was founded after, or not too long before, 711 A.D.?

Jerry Friedman
Thus spake Raymond S. Wise:

Fashion doesn't progress, so the analogy is fatally flawed. Like ... going to succeed, because they don't fit the real world.

What about the terminology (which is what I was addressing in the above)? What prompted linguists to rename "parts of speech" "word classes"? Surely you're not going to claim that was a scientific- corrective development.

I don't know whether it was or not and would have to read the arguments that were made for changing the terminology. Some changes in terminology, certainly, are of a scientific-corrective nature, such as the use of "standard dialect" for the standard variety of a language, and the separating out of "accent" from the meaning of "dialect," so that a person might be said, for example, to speak Standard American English with an RP accent.

Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com
Why are articles considered adjectives? They do not describe the ... they weren't grammatically significant I would think they are interjections.

They are not considered adjectives, except by the ignorant. You've been reading (or being taught by someone who's read) the ... the rules of the latter and applied them indiscriminately and dogmatically to the former." William Hazlitt 'English Grammar' (1829)

It has been three days since John Lawler wrote the above. In the past, I have made the analogy between the traditional grammarians and pseudoscientists. I have been strongly criticized for doing so. Yet what has John written above but just such an analogy? Note his use of the term "creationist grammar" very apt, I'd say. So I have been waiting for the critics to jump on him. Yet to this point no one who criticized me in the past for having expressed similar sentiments has seen fit to criticize John Lawler for his take on the matter!

Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com
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It certainly did. In my unarguably European now-hometown, that "all" ... lot of " it'd have to be "hardly any".

Do I take it that your now-hometown was founded after, or not too long before, 711 A.D.?

Pretty much, yes. The Romans did have a small garrison thingy here called, I think, Illiberis, but Granada as we know it had no truck with Latin worth mentioning until the priests said mass in it after
1492. Lots of Arabic, obviously, a bit of Castilian for trade, butalso much more Hebrew than people would think. They did a pretty good job around the turn of the 14th/15th century of rewriting the history books to exclude the major contribution of Jewish scholars to the culture of Al-Andalus and later the Kingdom of Granada.

Ross Howard
Yeah, and we don't call them "parts of speech" any longer, they're "word classes".

Has it changed again? They were "categories" when I studied the subject.

Evan Kirshenbaum + HP Laboratories >People think it must be fun to be a
1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 >super genius, but they don'tPalo Alto, CA 94304 >realize how hard it is to put up

http://www.kirshenbaum.net /
It certainly did. In my unarguably European now-hometown, that "all" ... lot of " it'd have to be "hardly any".

Do I take it that your now-hometown was founded after, or not too long before, 711 A.D.?

Ross is probably talking about a town in Spain that was founded by the Moors and in which the language of culture was Arabic. My question is: Can a town that was founded by invaders from Africa, speaking a language with its roots in Western Asia, be properly called "unarguably" European?
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Thus spake Evan Kirshenbaum:
Yeah, and we don't call them "parts of speech" any longer, they're "word classes".

Has it changed again? They were "categories" when I studied the subject.

We should run "genus" up a flag pole.

Simon R. Hughes
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