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Marc Adler wrote

semiretired wrote Or a low blow?

(URL link corrected above)

I clicked on the link that said "British Sign Language", but to my disappointment, the text was in English.
Worth reading the text aloud IMHO

That's the longest modern text I've ever seen in Scots, and it was surprisingly readable to this English speaker. Are there any native speakers here who can say whether it's the normal way they'd say it or whether it was an especially "English-friendly" wording?

Evan Kirshenbaum + HP Laboratories >Its like grasping the difference
1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 >between what one usually considersPalo Alto, CA 94304 >a 'difficult' problem, and what
www.sottish.parliament.uk/vli/language/scots/index.htm

And I've got this:
http://www.number-10.gov.uk/output/page308.asp
Online PM speeches (plus handsards!). There is another one live! from the Lords and the Commons (with handsards too).

Would you know of the respective Scottish stuff?
Thank you.
Tom
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Branch of English or a Separate Language? www.sottish.parliament.uk/vli/language/scots/index.htm

Sorry. Forgot to answer: don kno, loike.
Tom
A dialect. As far as I know, everyone who speaks ... not sure if it works the other way around, though.

It's a language because people who decide these things (the people who speak it) say it's a language. Who understands what is just not

There must be some Scots who don't consider Scots to be a separate language, but a dialect of English. Whether they constitute a minority or a majority of Scots, I have no idea.

Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com
Branch of English or a Separate Language?

A dialect. As far as I know, everyone who speaks Scots understands most forms of English. I'm not sure if it works the other way around, though.

Didn't they used to have their own language, Scots Gaelic? Now it's just a dialect of English. I actually didn't have that much trouble understanding that web page but it's a joke, right?
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speaking of
http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/vli/language/scots/index.htm
Didn't they used to have their own language, Scots Gaelic?

Gaelic or Gàidhlig is on another page.
http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/vli/language/gaelic/index.htm

Yes, I'm told that the Gaelic of Scotland differs somewhat from Irish Gaelic or Irish. It is that distinction that requires the phrase "Scots Gaelic" or "Scottish Gaelic."
Now it's just a dialect of English.

No, this Scots/English thing, no matter whether you call it "just a dialect of English" or anything else, is not Gaelic and never was. The early Angle settlers brought Old English to Scotland around the year 600 so it's had 1400 years to develop separately from southern English. (With considerable contact over the years with the south, of course.)
I actually didn't have that much trouble understanding that web page but it's a joke, right?

Are you accustomed to official government websites devoting pages to humorous spoofs?
No, as I understand it, it is not a joke. There is apparently a movement to take pride in Scots English (whatever they want to call it), use traditional (e.g. Burns) spellings that reflect the local pronunciation and to preserve dialect words and expressions. Why should they bow to the standards set elsewhere?

Best wishes Donna Richoux
speaking of http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/vli/language/scots/index.htm

Didn't they used to have their own language, Scots Gaelic?

Gaelic or Gàidhlig is on another page. http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/vli/language/gaelic/index.htm Yes, I'm told that the Gaelic of Scotland differs somewhat from Irish Gaelic or Irish. It is that distinction that requires the phrase "Scots Gaelic" or "Scottish Gaelic."

Not to mention Manx Gaelic.

Take a peek at soc.culture.scottish sometime. Look for some posts by Auld Bob Peffers. The following extracted from the first post I came across from Bob:
Ah murmelled richt sair tae pey hecht Fourth Brig chairges, Ah'll murmell e'en mair tae pey, "Congestion Tax", Ah've telt City Faithers jist whaur thae maun pit thaim, Bit Ah gie thaim fu warnin it weelmicht gar thaim rax. Sae Ah'll gan til St John's Toon, (the toon fowk noo ca Perth), An Ah'll veesit Dunfermline an, "The Auld Grey Toon", tae", Bit The Capital City's, the last place oan auld Earth", Whan, The Bonnie Dundee's ower the watters o Tay".

Then Ah'll gan til Glenrothes, Ah'll veesit, "The Lang Toon", Ah'll gan roond bi Kelty an roond Cowdenbeath,
Then Lochgelly, Ballingry an auld Achterderran,
An veesit High Vallyfield wi Culross beneath.
Sae fairweel tae yone city Ah've kent aa ma lang life. Wi it's ticht nievit coonc'llers an, "Congestion Tax". Ah'll no pey ony tax-toll tae cam ower frae auld Fife, Nor hae Stoot City Faithers live weel aff Fifers backs.

The above is part of a poem protest by Bob about a proposed "Congestion Charge" tax by the city of Edinburgh.
I'm not a native speaker, but I am reasonably familiar with Scots. At quite a few points the translators seem to have just given up. I don't think expressions like "business day", "professional tour guide", "official visit", "specific requirements", "contact details" or "educational and cultural policy" are really part of the language. It wouldn't always be easy to think of alternatives, because Scots is not often used to discuss such things. I can't see how they decided when to Scotticise a spelling, and when not to. "Business" seems like an obvious candidate.

Don Aitken
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on 9/10/04 6:17 AM: Sounds like many of us have been misled, Peter. Set us straigh!

I don't know what pictograms underlie the character he was talking about, but they weren't what he said they were. ... since they usually don't even respect the phonetic vs. radical components have nothing to do with their origin.

Ah. Gotcha.
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