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Nona The BritPossibly, but don't you think there is a difference between a tiny number of women who have agreed to dedicate their entire life and existence to religion wearing a 'uniform' they know is part of that life, and making the entire female population wear it, whether they want to or not?
who told you that they should wear it whether they wnat to or not u probably don't know that there is a lot of muslims women who don't wear it no one force her to put it her religon asks her to do so if se wants to she will if she doesn't want to she won't so it's kinda the same
WaïtiI find myself in full agreement with Nona... There is indeed a fundamental difference b/w the two situations that you try to compare here.
Those 2 being on one side a nun exercising her free will when she takes her vows and agrees on wearing the congregation's uniform ; on the other side a young girl or woman subjected to the social pressure resulting from the normative, reverent interpretation of any religion imposing on her the notion that she'd be a slut if she were to show her hair or face in public.

If modesty is the issue, dear Anon, then surely you'd also want women to avoid looking a man in the eyes, for that it is definitely not a sign they are modest enough, and you'd want them to look down when they talk to a man. Or maybe you wouldn't want them to talk to a man they don't know at all, since it is definitely not a modest thing to do, I mean to engage in a conversation with a total stranger...

As a man, I resent the idea that it is appropriate for a women to be veiled, and that the fact she isn't shows she lacks modesty. As if modesty was the supreme virtue for a women. As if it wasn't a matter of men not being aroused at the sight of a women ? I mean pleaaaaaaaaase, who's kidding who here ? What's at stake in ancient scriptures is the fact that men might have inappropriate thoughts when looking at an unveiled woman, and that she'd therefore be wise to hide whatever might turn a man on. As a man, I find it insulting to be told that I'm so incapable of controlling my urges that it would require for women to be veiled. Surely it may happens that I have sexual fantasies when looking at a woman, but it doesn't mean I would act on it, nor does it mean women should need any special protection from my thoughts. I'm the one liable for my thoughts, and the responsability on them lies on my side, not on somebody else's side.

As far as France expelling young girls from high school because they wear the islamic veil and won't agree to take it off when entering classroom... Well I can admit that it's a little extreme, but what about girls not agreeing to attend the sports class because they would have to play football in shorts ? Or girls skipping the natural science course because it teaches stuff that run contrary to the scriptures ? Where do you draw the line b/w what's acceptable as a compromise and what's not ? I'd be curious to know...

not true at all, probably u don't really know a lot aabout our society as me and hundrads of girls don't cover our hair and we are not considered "sluts" (the word sounds awfull innit?)and yep girls choose to wear it for example my sis does cover her hair while me and my mom don't it's like girls love to follow their religion and feel more comfortable by respecting it that's all
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In some countries it is voluntary but in other countries it is involuntary and women are forced to wear it whether they want to or not.
Aleen it depends which country you live in.

Some women live in countries where it is indeed compulsory to cover up in this way. I'm glad that it isn't in your country. If you choose to wear a veil then that's nice. But it is wrong of the countries that compel women to do so.
We respect the laws of other countries they should respect British law. It is ridiculous to go into class or court wearing a veil. It will upset the majoriy especially children in a class..
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Anonymous
It is one of the great ironies of our world today that the very same headscarf revered as a sign of 'holiness' when worn for the purpose of showing the authority of man by Catholic Nuns, is reviled as a sign of 'oppression' when worn for the purpose of protection by Muslim women.


very true!

At least you can see a Nun's face. Headscarfs aren't an issue. It's where the whole face is covered that can create a problem. In some situations it is just not practical. For example, in my line of work, there is only me and my assistant and there needs to be a good rapport between us. There is no way I could have a good rapport with an assistant if all I could see of her is her eyes - she's basically hidden herself away. Similarly, if someone came to a business meeting with me wearing sunglasses, I would ask them to take them off. I would also ask a veiled woman to remove her veil - not complete headscarf or anything, just the veil.

Now, muslim woman may well claim that it is their right to wear a full veil if they want to, and I don't disagree with that, but if excercising their right to wear a full veil encroaches on my rights - or if I need to go out of my way to accommodate it, then that is clearly unfair.

In the UK, there needs to be a balance in that women who choose to wear a full veil also need to apply common sense and remove it in the situations where it is not practical and instead of just expecting everybody else to accommodate it. In the UK, Islam is a minority faith, and whilst anyone is free to follow Islam here, it is up them to reconcile Islam with the way of life in the UK, and not the other way round.
Muslims in the Western World only want to make sure we don't forget that they are not part of our society. I consider it as an insult having to look at women totally covered up who raise their kids on welfare money. Just like they would be offended by my wife driving a car or wearing her favorite clothes in public. It's about respect that they obviously lack.
Anon, respect goes both ways. You require respect for your wife, but fail to give it to others who make different choices? But you claim others lack it. When people make sweeping stereotypes, as you have done by assuming veiled women use welfare money to raise their children, you lessen the credibility of your argument. There are many things that trouble me about our welfare system, but what the women wear is truly an aspect that had never crossed my mind.
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Grammar GeekAnon, respect goes both ways. You require respect for your wife, but fail to give it to others who make different choices? But you claim others lack it. When people make sweeping stereotypes, as you have done by assuming veiled women use welfare money to raise their children, you lessen the credibility of your argument. There are many things that trouble me about our welfare system, but what the women wear is truly an aspect that had never crossed my mind.
I forgot my password...I am Coburn from Germany.

Immigration to Germany is quite different from that in the US. We almost exclusively get the illiterate and poor. Anyway, what I was trying to say was that I surely couldn't do the things I am doing in Germany as freely in Arab countries. And I would act accordingly out of respect for their way of life if I chose to move to let's say Oman or Saudi Arabia. In turn I demand the same for me which would include dressing up in an appropriate way. I wonder what my neighbors in an Arab country would say if I started throwing pork sausages in the barbecue pit and pop open a beeer in my back yard.. They more than likely wouldn't tolerate my way of life either.
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