re: I've Been Here Too Long page 3

"Gravy cheese"? How does that work?

Easy-peasey. "Gravy" is Italian-American for tomato-based pasta sauce.

Cross-threading here..there's another thread about "I could give a damn less" wherein I challenge Google counts to be an accurate portrayal of conversational usage.
"Gravy cheese" has 679 hits, but I looked at five pages of hits and never saw one with "gravy cheese" meaning Parmesan cheese. Most were instances of lists like "meat loaf with gravy, cheese sandwiches.." where "gravy" and "cheese" just appeared in sequence. From this, one might deduce that there is no evidence that "gravy cheese" doesn't exist as a term. Indeed, even evidence that it doesn't.

Yet, I heard the expression used by an actual human being just yesterday. Michael's reply indicated that he isn't stumped by the usage. Even Areff seems to accept it as possible.

That indicates to me that there are expressions used in conversation that just don't get written on the web where Google can ferret them out. Either the people using the expression write out "Parmesan cheese" when writing about "gravy cheese", or they don't enter anything on the web.
BTW, I had never heard what I call "spaghetti sauce" referred to as "gravy" for the first six decades or so of my life. It wasn't until I heard it on "The Sopranos" and saw it discussed here that I knew it existed as a usage.

What's perverse about being a Dutch sea captain?
The Dutch didn't discriminate, and went by ability,
Jan

The Swede Jonas Bronck, who was, perversely, a Dutch sea-captain, started his farm on the northeast bank of the Haarlem (Harlem) River in 1639.

What's perverse about being a Dutch sea captain? The Dutch didn't discriminate, and went by ability,

Not that this answers your question, but in the song "Waiting For the Day (The Wost Old Ship)," one of the many complaints about the ship is that "the skipper's half Dutch."
http://www.antrina.net/suffolk/worst old ship.htm

SML
http://pirate-women.com

Areff wrote on 29 Jun 2004:

Not in general; my Eastern Massachusetts/Northeastern New Jersey Italian-American relatives ... a New York-area thing, and is probably uncommon among post-Sputniks.

None of my northeastern New Jersey Italian relatives ever called the sauce "gravy". But we're from the deep south: Calabria, not Napoli.

It just occurred to me maybe Coop misheard "grated cheese" as "gravy cheese"? "Grated cheese" is what I would call what he seems to be talking from (however, one would hope that the cheese was Pecorino Romano and not "parmesan").
"Gravy cheese" sounds like a strange term to use, even if one uses "gravy" to mean "tomato sauce" (by which I mean tomato sauce in the AmE sense, not the BrE sense, for BrE "tomato sauce" = AmE "ketchup").

It just occurred to me maybe Coop misheard "grated cheese" as "gravy cheese"? "Grated cheese" is what I would call what he seems to be talking from (however, one would hope that the cheese was Pecorino Romano and not "parmesan").

No, I did not mishear. Despite the fact that the man was from the New York City suburb of Bensonhurst, he spoke reasonably understandable English.
I would expect "grated cheese" to be used when the server comes to you and grates the cheese over your plate. This man was clearly asking for the shaker of cheese to be passed.

"Gravy cheese" sounds like a strange term to use,

Yes. That's why I bothered to report it here. Had he asked for the shaker of cheese to be passed, I wouldn't have brought it up. Had he just grunted and pointed I would not have brought it up.

It just occurred to me maybe Coop misheard "grated ... hope that the cheese was Pecorino Romano and not "parmesan").

No, I did not mishear. Despite the fact that the man was from the New York City suburb of Bensonhurst, he spoke reasonably understandable English.

Coop, I assume you're being jocular here. Bensonhurst is a neighborhood of Brooklyn (Fourth Largest City in America). It might have been described as "a New York City suburb" an hundred years ago (it was sort of planned as a suburb for what were beeack then called 'mechanics', I think). Of old people in that neighborhood had relatively thick accents, so I'm surprised you were able to understand the guy. That slike so wei'd. Does he like disco?

I would expect "grated cheese" to be used when the server comes to you and grates the cheese over your plate. This man was clearly asking for the shaker of cheese to be passed.

But what's inside the shaker is "grated cheese", or more likely an ersatz substitute. What would you call it? Suppose it's not "parmesan", and suppose you don't know what type it is, and suppose you want to be more specific than "cheese". Me, I'd call it "grated cheese". Those offal cans of ersatz grated cheese I see in supermarkets are packaged for the Goyim(tm), but it's still within the "grated cheese" class in a broad sense. So too for your "shaker" of cheese.
I still say that you must have misheard his saying "grated cheese". This is a term used by people in New York (LCIA).
Maybe the guy meant to say "grated cheese" and he got tongue-tied and it came out sounding like "grave-ed cheese", and then you heard it as "gravy cheese".

"Gravy cheese" sounds like a strange term to use,

Yes. That's why I bothered to report it here. Had he asked for the shaker of cheese to be passed, I wouldn't have brought it up. Had he just grunted and pointed I would not have brought it up.

Had I eaten the gravy cheese, I'd have brought it up.

Matti

Easy-peasey. "Gravy" is Italian-American for tomato-based pasta sauce.

Not in general; my Eastern Massachusetts/Northeastern New Jersey Italian-American relatives don't use it; in fact, I've personally only encountered this use of "gravy" in Italiansploitation(TM) films and TV shows. I gather that it was a New York-area thing, and is probably uncommon among post-Sputniks.

It's my observation that it's 3d Generation Italian-Americans and "Italians" in "Italiansploitation(TM) films and TV shows" that confuse gravy and sauce.

All the 1st and 2nd Generation Italian-Americans I grew-up with (No. Jersey-Greater NYC area) knew - and still know - the difference between the two.
In both French and Italian culinary terms, gravy is a meat-based or meat-flavored or meat-infused sauce. So if you cook your meatballs in the sauce, you can call it a gravy. Bolognese is a gravy; puttanesca, alfrado, pesto, olio and, of course, marinara, are not, they are sauces just as most ItAmers call them.
Regards,
Frank

Aue has become too much of my life. No, curb your enthusiasm, this is not an "I'm outta here" post. ... man indeed". I wonder if "lovely" and "man" are ever spoken in the same sentence by anyone that isn't Irish.

(...good ethnologiocal data snipped...)
Wales, too; though more often "lovely boy", John Bull's other appendage being one of those places where men are boys.

Mike.