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You would think he would’ve helped her yesterday. I know this sentence mean he didn’t help her. Can I also say the following sentence below to show the same meaning which is counter factual?

I think he would’ve helped her.

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anonymousCan I also say the following sentence below to show the same meaning

No. This may sound strange, but the sentence below means exactly what it says.

I think (that) he would have helped her.

"I think that ..." means "I don't know for sure whether ..., but I'm inclined to believe it".


I think that he would like that gift > I don't know for sure whether he is going to like that gift, but I'm inclined to believe that he will.
I think that he would have liked that gift > I don't know for sure whether he liked that gift, but I'm inclined to believe that he did.


Counterfactual and nonfactual are two different things. The sentences above are nonfactual.

CJ

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CalifJim
anonymousCan I also say the following sentence below to show the same meaning

No. This may sound strange, but the sentence below means exactly what it says.

I think (that) he would have helped her.

"I think that ..." means "I don't know for sure whether ..., but I'm inclined to believe it".


I think that he would like that gift > I don't know for sure whether he is going to like that gift, but I'm inclined to believe that he will.
I think that he would have liked that gift > I don't know for sure whether he liked that gift, but I'm inclined to believe that he did.


Counterfactual and nonfactual are two different things. The sentences above are nonfactual.

CJ

Just to confirm. Are you saying the sentence below is correct and shows non factual?

I think (that) he would have helped her.

Also, this sentence doesn’t have an implied if clause or implied condition, am I correct?

anonymousJust to confirm. Are you saying the sentence below is correct and shows non factual?
I think (that) he would have helped her.

Yes. "I think" is what makes it nonfactual. It's the speaker's opinion, not a fact.

anonymousAlso, this sentence doesn’t have an implied if clause or implied condition, am I correct?

In my opinion, you are correct. I don't see any if-clause that would make sense there.

CJ

CalifJim
anonymousJust to confirm. Are you saying the sentence below is correct and shows non factual?
I think (that) he would have helped her.

Yes. "I think" is what makes it nonfactual. It's the speaker's opinion, not a fact.

anonymousAlso, this sentence doesn’t have an implied if clause or implied condition, am I correct?

In my opinion, you are correct. I don't see any if-clause that would make sense there.

CJ

Thank you so much. I have got an example. Would you mind checking it please?

I did not get to see the UFC match between Daniel Cormier and Steve Miocic. I really missed out. That would’ve been a great match.


Is this would’ve in the sentence non factual like you examples?

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anonymous
CalifJim
anonymousJust to confirm. Are you saying the sentence below is correct and shows non factual?
I think (that) he would have helped her.

Yes. "I think" is what makes it nonfactual. It's the speaker's opinion, not a fact.

anonymousAlso, this sentence doesn’t have an implied if clause or implied condition, am I correct?

In my opinion, you are correct. I don't see any if-clause that would make sense there.

CJ

Thank you so much. I have got an example. Would you mind checking it please?

I did not get to see the UFC match between Daniel Cormier and Steve Miocic. I really missed out. That would’ve been a great match.


Is this would’ve in the sentence non factual like you examples?

Also,

How do the listener know whether the sentence with ‘would’ve’ is non factual or conditional? They look the same.

I think he would’ve helped her. (Non factual and non conditional)

I think he would’ve helped her.(if she had asked him politely)

anonymousI did not get to see the UFC match between Daniel Cormier and Steve Miocic. I really missed out. That would’ve been a great match.
Is this would’ve in the sentence nonfactual like your examples?

The match has already taken place, so either the match was great or it wasn't. "The match was great" and "The match was not great" are both factual, but the speaker doesn't know which it is. That makes it nonfactual.

I don't see, however, that anything of great importance hinges on whether it's nonfactual or not, just as long as you can see that it's not counterfactual.

CJ

anonymousHow do the listener know whether the sentence with ‘would’ve’ is non factual or conditional?

Those two aren't comparable. The distinction is between factual, nonfactual, and counterfactual. These may apply to any sentence, whether it's a conditional sentence or not. However, those terms are of greater interest in sentences with 'would', so there is a somewhat indirect connection with conditionals.

Don't get hung up on terminology. We're just using a few terms to show the difference between knowing that a statement is contrary to the truth and not knowing whether it's true or not.

anonymousHow does the listener know whether the sentence with ‘would’ve’ is nonfactual or conditional? They look the same.
I think he would’ve helped her. (Non factual and non conditional)
I think he would’ve helped her.(if she had asked him politely)

It's best not to call a sentence conditional when there is no explicit if-clause. As we've seen before, you can very frequently add an almost meaningless if-clause everywhere you see 'would'. That doesn't prove anything, and it doesn't help your understanding of any of this.

And besides, 'nonfactual' and 'conditional' are not mutually exclusive, as I explained above.

CJ

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Thank you again. I am still little confused. How does the listener know whether ‘would’ is used to show non factual or conditional? Is it by the context? Just like how we know that there is some implied condition with the use of would in the sentence.

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