# re: Sundaymorningfunpage 26

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} Are there any real or metaphorical (as with Times Square) squares in the } US for which you can use the preposition "on"? Not in my experience.

On the Free Parking square.

R. J. Valentine

Aaron Dinkin:
I thought things were in Times Square.

Richard Fontana:
You rang? Things are indeed in* Times Square, not *on.

There are some cities where a named square/circle/place/... extends its name to the surrounding street. For example, I remember being surprised by this layout the last time I was in London, when I was finding the hotel on Belgrave Road where I had a reservation:
x

y >

(north is to the upper left) (view using monospaced font)

A-B and C-D are both parts of Belgrave Road; similarly, E-F and G-H are parts of St. George's Drive. But B-C is not part of Belgrave Road; along with C-G, G-F, and F-B, it forms a street named Warwick Square. And in American English, a house at "x" would therefore be *on* Warwick Square.

Further, even if B-C was part of Belgrave Road and so on, it would make some sense to say that the "square" referred to the central inside BCGF, and a house at "x", being just outside it, would still be *on* the square. A building at "y", on the other hand, would be "in" the square and, of course, named squares like this typically don't have many buildings in them.
Somehow I got into some form of thinking like that about Times Square. But it doesn't apply; Times Square (the one we're talking about) is not the name of a street, and there is no actual central square anyway.
Are there any real or metaphorical (as with Times Square) squares in the US for which you can use the preposition "on"?

I think the second style of reasoning (x is on the square, y is in the square) makes sense whenever there is an actual square. Here are some Google counts to demonstrate the existence of the "on" usage, although I'm not going to examine the hits to see if any distinction is being made between "on" and "in".
"on union square" "san francisco" 13,100
"in union square" "san francisco" 8,890
"on washington square" "new york" 3,120
"in washington square" "new york" 7,410
"on washington square" chicago 569
"in washington square" chicago 1,610
"on farragut square" washington 142
"in farragut square" washington 319
"on lafayette square" "new orleans" 109
"in lafayette square" "new orleans" 243

Mark Brader, "It is impossible. Solution follows..." Toronto, (Email Removed) Richard Heathfield

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It's quite common to hear "the" in front interstate as in "Take the I-95 to the West Palm Beach exit."

Curiously if this be true, the articles must fly out the window en route, as I've never heard anybody in West Palm Beach say "the I-95."

Whereas (once again), the reverse is true in the UK. It is very rare to hear the usage "M5" or "M25" or "A38", the normal usage is "the M5" or "the M25" or the "A38". Some motoring journalists and government officials have made valiant efforts to introduce the article-less form, but the general public have resisted it.

GC
Most irritating street name in London: Avenue Road.

London? Why not Toronto? Let us also remember Street Road, in Philadelphia.

Some maps show Chicago's Broadway(1) as "Broadway Street", but I'd have to assume that's an error.
(1)Originally Evanston Avenue, and I'd guess before that the Evanston Road, it was renamed "Broadway" in an effort to New Yorkify Chicago. Bwahahaha!
London? Why not Toronto? Let us also remember Street Road, in Philadelphia.

Some maps show Chicago's Broadway(1) as "Broadway Street", but I'd have to assume that's an error.

Why would you assume that? As I recall,
the north-south streets are "Street" and the
generally north-south, though as I recall
it zigzags here and there.

Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
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Some maps show Chicago's Broadway(1) as "Broadway Street", but I'd have to assume that's an error.

Why would you assume that? As I recall, the north-south streets are "Street" and the east-wests are "Avenue". Broadway runs generally north-south, though as I recall it zigzags here and there.

I've just realized that State, Wabash, and
Michigan Avenues are notable exceptions.
Still, I believe there's something to it.

Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
Why would you assume that? As I recall, the north-south ... north-south, though as I recall it zigzags here and there.

I've just realized that State, Wabash, and Michigan Avenues are notable exceptions. Still, I believe there's something to it.

No, not State Street. Just the other two. Sheesh.

Michael West
Melbourne, Australia
Some maps show Chicago's Broadway(1) as "Broadway Street", but I'd have to assume that's an error.

Why would you assume that? As I recall, the north-south streets are "Street" and the east-wests are "Avenue". Broadway runs generally north-south, though as I recall it zigzags here and there.

Not unlike Manhattan's Broadway (Chicago's Broadway looks a whole lot more like Astoria's Broadway), yet of course Manhattan's Broadway is not "Broadway Avenue". Manhattan, in its grid section, has east-west "streets" and north-south "avenues", in contrast to Chicago.

"Broadway Street" is obviously redundant (btw, Manhattan also has a Broad Street, below (hi Coop) the grid), but anyway if Evanston Avenue was renamed "Broadway" in imitation of Manhattan, you'd think that they'd've realized that Manhattan's Broadway was not "Broadway Street" (or "Broadway Avenue" or Broadway anything).
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London? Why not Toronto? Let us also remember Street Road, in Philadelphia.

Some maps show Chicago's Broadway(1) as "Broadway Street", but I'd have to assume that's an error. (1)Originally Evanston Avenue, and I'd guess before that the Evanston Road, it was renamed "Broadway" in an effort to New Yorkify Chicago. Bwahahaha!

That's OK. Here, in Hayward, we also have a piece of New York. On MapQuest it is labeled "Broadway Street", but in real life the signs say only "Broadway". The street is very narrow, but the name makes up for that. It is also in two separate pieces, each two blocks long, and that's all, but what're you gonna do? You live with what you've got.
Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/