re: Teenagers page 4

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I myself became a teenager in 1948 and I can't ... surprise. Some aspects of teenage culture definitely began earlier ...

Donna Richoux writes (without naming the dictionary cited):
I find this interesting: Main Entry: teen·age Variant(s): or teen·aged \-jd\ Date: 1921 ... teen adjective In particular, I wonder what they could have found in 1818, and where. Is it in the OED?

The OED1 has "teenage" cites from c.1700 and from 1706 only the meaning of this word is "brushwood for fences and hedges"! It comes from "teen", a Kentish dialect verb meaning "to fence, hedge in, make a hedge with raddles", related to "tine".

It does not have "teenage" or "teenager" in the age sense, but it does have an entry for a "teen ... usually in pl. teens". In reference to years of a person's life, this is cited as early as 1673; meaning a teenager, it is cited from 1820 (in a book title: "Advice to the Teens; or, Practical Helps to the Formation of Character"). So the dictionary Donna cites has antedated this by two years.
"Teener" is also cited, meaning a teenager. This is from 1894 and reads "This rigid man was wound round the finger of a female 'teener' as the Americans beautifully express it."

This entry was written in 1911. The 1933 supplement does not add "teenage" or "teenager" in the age sense, but of course the 1980s supplement does. The earliest cite for "teen age" not only written as two words, but in scare quotes like the above cite is from 1921. The next few cites are hyphenated, and the one cite actually spelled "teenage" is from 1977. For "teen-ager", the first cite is from 1941 (in Popular Science Monthly), the first unhyphenated cite is from 1960 (Kingsley Amis), and the most recent cite, from the Times Literary Supplement in 1980, reads "Teenagers, of course had not been invented in the 1880s".

Mark Brader "It is hard to be brave," said Piglet, sniffing Toronto slightly, when you're only a Very Small Animal". (Email Removed) A. A. Milne, Winnie-the-Pooh

My text in this article is in the public domain.
One football game of the season (autumn) is designated as the Homecoming game. There's various sorts of rigamarole, such as a parade with floats, election of a king and queen (popularity & looks), a pep rally, a dance. Some connection is made to inviting previous students back to the school for the event, hence the name.

For high schools, that was the occasion of the last football game of the season played on the home field. A queen was elected to reign over the proceedings. It was a big deal.

Sounds like the tradition is a thing of the past?
There are 13,000 GoogleWeb hits for

For us, homecoming was the first home game of the football season. I thought at the time that that was the reason for the term. Donna is probably right, but by then my high school had adopted the prison model so did not allow any previous students back on the campus.
Richard Maurer To reply, remove half
Sunnyvale, California of a homonym of a synonym for also. (a subthread of Teenagers)
Students: Are you brave enough to let our tutors analyse your pronunciation?
Bobbysoxers were indeed female, an so-called because the socks that they wore were cut low over the shoe or "bobbed". ... in those times. See: for a photo of a girl in bobby sox, saddle oxfords, and a poodle skirt.[/nq]
That is probably a post-era picture maybe current-day costume for a 50s dance, don't you think? The saddle oxfords I remember were a little different more like this (upper left):
http://tinyurl.com/4ng2k
but with a black "saddle" on white. Note the thicker soles, and the shape of the "saddle." I don't remember for sure what color the soles were for the black-on-white saddle oxfords. (There was a verticle strip, same color as the "saddle" on the heel seam.)
I think by the time I was wearing saddle oxfords (and white bucks, loafers, etc.), the socks were like the ones in the following illustration, and worn in that manner, but the socks were WHITE, not blue..

...later on, the "rolled down" cuffs came back into popularity. "Crew" socks were popular, too. http://tinyurl.com/49j6r (first two pictures). But most of the time, the girls wore "flatties" (usually in black, red, or white) and nylons. (There were no panty hose when I was in high school, and the stockings had seams until around 1958-9 or so.)

Maria Conlon
Flatties: One day I wore my black ones and my girlfriend wore her red ones. We wore the same size shoe. So during one class, we switched but the right shoe only. We wanted to see who would notice. Of course, we had to get up and walk somewhere for anyone to see, but we managed to do that. What the heck, it broke up the day.
Bobbysoxers were indeed female, an so-called because the socks that ... girl in bobby sox, saddle oxfords, and a poodle skirt.

That is probably a post-era picture maybe current-day costume for a 50s dance, don't you think? The saddle oxfords ... were for the black-on-white saddle oxfords. (There was a verticle strip, same color as the "saddle" on the heel seam.)

Yes, the image was from a costume site.
In my era, there was a status to soles. Saddle shoes or bucks with black soles were out. The only acceptable soles were red. My Dad finally caved and bought me a pair of white bucks with black soles. (Black soled brands were cheaper) It was impossible to explain to him that the sole color made a difference.
Flatties:

At BRHS, they were Capizios.
The zoot suit did evolve from the negro community.

It evolved from what might then have been called the "Negro community", yes.
Bobby socks did evolve from the white teen girl community.

Prove it. Prove that it wasn't a simultaneous development. You think all the white teenage girls were wearing bobby sox and all the black teenage girls weren't? I'm not suggesting that bobby sox originated in the black community, but it was a general American trend, not a "white" trend, unless you equate "American" with "white".
Black people did not generally embrace Sinatra in the bobbysox era.

Neither did white people. The older generation preferred Bing Crosby or whatever. OTOH, plenty of black listeners liked Sinatra, whose style was pretty close to that of contemporary black singers (Billie Holiday, Billy Eckstine, etc.).
Segregation is not directly tied to the subject at hand except in the sense that there were two separate racial communities each with their own styles, fads, interests, etc.

There was no monolithic "white community" then or now creating "white fashions". There were general American fashion developments which necessarily reflected the white majority and necessarily influenced the black minority (which in some cases originated the trend to begin with, as with the Zoot suit).
What sort of socks were black teenage girls wearing in the 1940s, I ask you, Coop?
You know, Coop, it occurs to me that one problem here is that AUE has always seriously been lacking in perspectives and contributions from African-American posters. We're talking about over ten percent of the US population. Are ten percent of AUE's American posters black? I don't think so (I'm aware of only one semi-regular poster who is apparently African-American). Are we, the Posters of AUE, responsible for this state of affairs? I don't know, but when you start apparently seriously posting things about "the negro (sic) community" I have to wonder, Coop.

I suspect that we do have a number of African-American lurkers. I urge them to contribute.
Different subject, but how about black posters from other societies? For example, I'd like to see some black South Africans slap Steve Hayes around when he starts going off on how wonderful white South African liberals are. You and I don't have the credentials to do that, in English usage.
I'd like 2005 to be the year that AUE becomes a truly diverse newsgroup, without of course sacrificing posting quality.

Steny '08!
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Flatties:

At BRHS, they were Capizios.

Capezios.

Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/
I'd like 2005 to be the year that AUE becomes
a truly diverse newsgroup,
without of course sacrificing posting quality.
But we are diverse now some of us know some physics, while others know how to code in assembly.
Richard Maurer To reply, remove half
Sunnyvale, California of a homonym of a synonym for also.
I wonder if other languages than English have the word "teenager" and the associated concepts.

Dutch has 'tiener', from 'tien'.
but I don't know how old it is,
so it may be translated teenager,
Jan
Students: We have free audio pronunciation exercises.
What sort of socks were black teenage girls wearing in the 1940s, I ask you, Coop?

At San Jose High, the 1950 graduating class of around 523 students had nine blacks. Six were girls. They dressed the same as the rest of the girls.

Skitt (in Hayward, California)
www.geocities.com/opus731/
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