1 2 3 4
Have you ever been approached by a 14-year-old who put ... request, is the kid a victim? Am I a criminal?

Yes and yes, if you're older than 15 or 16. And if you're older than 18 and believe that it's ... the come-ons of minors as reasonable and competent invitations for consensual adult sexual relationships, then you are judgmentally impaired, IMHO

Remember when you first became interested in girls. Around 12 or 13 you started noticing them and getting those thoughts. You didn't cause it a preset program kicked in, and if you were lucky, you were attracted by the opposite sex.
For a certain percentage of boys at that same age the new feeling which comes about is noticing cute boys, or maybe noticing masculine older men or some other attraction.
Since it's hormones and genes and won't be changed, Does it matter if the object of this 13 year olds sexual attraction agrees or not? That is, a 14 year old who approaches a grown man and asks for sex is already pre programmed that way.
The risk to the 14 year old if the adult consents is not that the 14 year old may become sexually different he already is.
The risk is that the kid will get an STD.
Now the fact that this 14 year old will not be harmed does not mean we should eliminate the "age of consent" concept.
We don't want debates in Court if the impressionable cub scout consented to sex with the den leader.
That is, a 14 year old who approaches a grown man and asks for sex is already pre programmed that way.

Not only that, but almost certainly experienced as well. That was my point in positing the original question.

Gary G. Taylor * Rialto, CA
gary at donavan dot org / http:// geetee dot donavan dot org "The two most abundant things in the universe
are hydrogen and stupidity." Harlan Ellison
Students: We have free audio pronunciation exercises.
It does seem worth pointing out that children at the receiving end of sexual encounters with adults are indeed victims.

Have you ever been approached by a 14-year-old who put his hand down the front of your pants and said ... when it comes to having sex with someone older? Most European countries have an age of consent of 16 (http://www.ageofconsent.com).

In Denmark it is 15. In EU-countries like Austria, Estonia, Italy 14. In EU-countries like Spain and Malta 13, in the Netherlands 12.

http://www.ageofconsent.com/ageofconsent.htm
In general it seems that the age of consent varies from 12 to 21 years though some countries criminalize every sexual relation outside (heterosexual) marriage and some countries will send two 70-year-old men to prison for having been in bed together.
BTW, the Danish age of consent is not /always/ 15. For parents and people "in place of a parent" like teachers and scout leaders, the age is 18, and heterosexual incest is forbitten no matter the age. Furthermore there is an old 12 year age of consent which was moved to 15 in 1930. Adults who have sex with children under the age of 12 will have their punishment doubled. Since we've also got a rule saying that there will be no punishment if those taking part in sex "in age or development" are at about the same age (15-year-olds arent being punished for having sex with 14-year-olds), I guess this age of 12 is the lower age for that rule too.

Per Erik Rønne
Rushtown wrote on 24 Apr 2004:
Remember when you first became interested in girls.

Yep. I was in 2nd grade, about 7 years old.
Around 12 or 13 you started noticing them and getting those thoughts.

I was chasing them around their apartments a couple of years before that.
You didn't cause it a preset program kicked in, and if you were lucky, you were attracted by the opposite sex.

That's a value judgment I don't want to make.
For a certain percentage of boys at that same age the new feeling which comes about is noticing cute boys, or maybe noticing masculine older men or some other attraction.

Yeah, I've read all about that in Yukio Mishima's outstanding autobiographical novel Confessions of a Mask .
Since it's hormones and genes and won't be changed, Does it matter if the object of this 13 year olds ... is, a 14 year old who approaches a grown man and asks for sex is already pre programmed that way.

What's your point? I didn't have anything to say about the sexual orientation of the 14-year-old or the object of his sexual desire.
The risk to the 14 year old if the adult consents is not that the 14 year old may become sexually different he already is.

Fourteen-year-olds who would do what Gary Taylor described are obviously either already midnight cowboys or not heterosexual. I have no problem with that.
The risk is that the kid will get an STD.

That's true enough.
Now the fact that this 14 year old will not be harmed does not mean we should eliminate the "age of consent" concept.

I'm not sure what you mean by "harmed". How do you know the kid will not be "harmed"? Do you mean that because he's so sexually agressive, the damage has already been done and that he cannot be "harmed" to any greater extent?
We don't want debates in Court if the impressionable cub scout consented to sex with the den leader.

Right. The den master is guilty of betraying a trust probably taken for granted by the kid's parents.

Franke: EFL teacher & medical editor.
For email, ehziuh htiw rehpycrebyc ecalper.
Gary G. Taylor wrote on 24 Apr 2004:
You'd better make damn sure you never get convicted of ... of even touching you except to kill you) in prison

Yes, I know; I already have been. Read my web site.

I did. Well, it looks like you were the victim.

Franke: EFL teacher & medical editor.
For email, ehziuh htiw rehpycrebyc ecalper.
Site Hint: Check out our list of pronunciation videos.
Gary G. Taylor wrote on 25 Apr 2004:
That is, a 14 year old who approaches a grown man and asks for sex is already pre programmed that way.

Not only that, but almost certainly experienced as well. That was my point in positing the original question.

That is probably true, but the authorities don't care.

Franke: EFL teacher & medical editor.
For email, ehziuh htiw rehpycrebyc ecalper.
Regardless of the validity or truth of your position, you will be quashed, squashed, and debauched (if your prisonmates can stand the idea of even touching you except to kill you) in prison.

If what you can read about American prisons on the internet is true, that is not what would happen.
He would be gang-raped on a dayly basis instead. As would Michael Jackson if sentenced to jail. He might as well commit suicide as soon as such a sentence is given.

Per Erik Rønne
"Pedophile" means lover of children.

In fact, it does not. It was coined in 1906, according to MWCD11, which identifies its etymology as "New Latin," which in turn is identified as "Latin as used since the end of the medieval period especially in scientific description and classification." The "philia" in "pedophilia" was a New Latin term used for coining medical terms for what are now generally referred to as "paraphilias," such as "coprophilia" and "necrophilia." The object of abnormal sexual attraction is referred to in the first half of the word, followed by "philia," which is used to indicate that the sexual attraction in question is abnormal.
Meaning is determined by usage, and "paedophilia"/"pedophilia" has always been a medical term, never a term in which the "philia" meant "friendship," which is what it meant in Greek, from which word the New Latin term was borrowed.

Raymond S. Wise
Minneapolis, Minnesota USA
E-mail: mplsray @ yahoo . com
Students: Are you brave enough to let our tutors analyse your pronunciation?
Regardless of the validity or truth of your position, you will be quashed, squashed, and debauched (if your prisonmates can stand the idea of even touching you except to kill you) in prison.

If what you can read about American prisons on the internet is true, that is not what would happen.
He would be gang-raped on a daily basis instead. As would Michael Jackson if sentenced to jail. He might as well commit suicide as soon as such a sentence is given.

Per Erik Rønne
Show more